His bid affected the final price, because he got outbid by someone. If his ‘false’ bid wasn’t there, the price could in theory be 2k lower.
That could be right, but we will never know what the bids of the higher bidders are. If he didn’t bid, the other higher bidders might still bid for example $17k, $18k, $19k as their max. However if we know that if the other higher bidders have their max below or at the $16k mark then ultimately his bid affected the price. That auction is for an already known $18k card as it was the second copy(or the third i’m not so sure). That is why many people would think that the $18k price tag is the benchmark and there will be people who would bid less than that so that if they won, they would get a steal but that doesn’t happen most of the time.
Its like bidding in general, shill bidding.we can speculate and say it will have sold for this that anyways.We dont know, but the fact of the matter is…these scumbags are artificially raising the price for the laugh. Its disgusting, and i hope they get caught out and fine/forced to pay every month for the next 10 years with a nice % charge extra.
If I have a max price of 500, and some other guy has max of 400, and one guy bids 200. I see the lising and think…oo I may get this around my range! I bid 300, and the other guy bids 400 as max, i bid 500 as my max. so its ticking down at say 401…then some douche troll/shill bidder bids 410,420,430 etc then it ends at 491 …yes I won it…yes i wanted to pay 500 but the fact is…i would ahve got it for 401 if the guy who wasnt interested in buying it raised the price.Or they bid 800…retract and the second highest was my 500. yes i was fine with 500 butt its not the real price it should have sold for.
Hope that makes sense…a bit of a rant 
really pisses me off when people do stuff like this for fun. go on social media and troll people or do whatever you lowlifes do, but dont mess with our money, our emotions and livelyhood.
It should be illegal and punishable by the amputation of limbs. Imo it is comparable to theft and fraud.
Has anyone got the full conversation, screenshots etc and mentioned it to pwcc? because if there is hard evidence…the auction is void(well you get what i mean)
Gary, as everyone else has mentioned…I would be very very careful…i know you want the card but why spend alot more than you wanted or were going because trolls are messing with auctions. If his max is 50k, lets hope he gets stuck with it and pwwc message for the money. I know im not buying or ever will, however I dont want good honest people on the forum and anywhere to be shill bid up by some stupid kids.
@garyis2000
(im not reading back as it negates the point of the post and the rant lol!)
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@geg89 I totally agree that this BGS 10 auction is tampered as it is the FIRST copy to break its own record price. However I am not saying the same for the PSA 10 1st ed charizard that this James Tan guy bid on.
Take your example of the $500 max auction bid. If someone without any intention to pay bid $400 BUT there are 3 other people who are willing to pay have max bids of say $450, $480 and your $500. You won the auction at $490 but in essence the guy that bid $400 didn’t affect the final price. This is relatable to the second(or third) copy of the $18k PSA 10 1st ed zard that PWCC auctioned off that involved this James Tan. People knew what the card is worth after previous auctions, which is $18k, so a $16k bid won’t affect the final price if there are 3 other people having a higher max bid.
The BGS 10 is a different story as people without an intention to pay have already bid on a price that surpassed anything we have ever imagined. This current bid price will affect the final price for sure as there are no records indicating how much a BGS 10 should be worth.
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Yea I understand, it just sounds like the guys bidding higher who ahve no intention of purchasing…can affect the actual serious bidders. It may well sell for over 50k with legit buyers…however…the fact the price has been beefed up by non serious buyers means it inflates the price and forces these real buyers to pay more.(even if they were willing to, just because my max bid is 100k does not mean the card is worth that or im fine just paying it when i can get the auction for 50k 60k 
)
Fair point. In the end the real value of how much it is worth is based on how much the highest bidder is willing to pay since we can’t match it against previous sales of the card since there was only 1 and that was a while ago and we all know that the prices on everything has changed since then.
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At the end what really matters is the amount it sells for. Shill bid or not if someone actually paid for it then they value it at that price.
Edit: What the previous post said^
It is inflating the price pre maturely.
Are people not concerned about the inevitable POP rise of BGS 10 Pristine 'zard? This kind of price hike is not sustainable especially in the context of a new record price being set partly due to auction tampering.
If this sells for $60k+ and people can actively pick up a PSA 10 for one-third of the price (even less), I wouldn’t be surprised if we start to see a bunch of attempted crossgrades just to raise the Pristine pop or take advantage of this new “record” selling price to try to offload one (on the off chance someone gets the Pristine grade) and then essentially get a PSA 10 or two for “free”…(or is that just highly unlikely)?
I hate to see people spend money unnecessarily whether they value this card at its final price or not because i’ve been the victim of people bidding up auctions literally just to troll and it’s there’s few things more infuriating than that in the hobby…it’s akin to lighting that extra cash on fire just to get a card you were already going to get anyways. 
We talked about this earlier in this thread. The chances of that are less than 1 percent. Gary personally has sent 100 PSA 10s that he thought were perfect for cross grade BGS 10. Not a single one came back a BGS 10. BGS 10 is the unicorn of all cards. The fact that there are even 2 for this specific card is absolutely unreal.
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I don’t see many more BGS Pristine Charizards 1st ed appearing, maybe if all of the PSA 10s went for it, you would get 1 or 2 more. And probably BGS will make it harder to even get those 10 subgrades.
____
It is unfortunate that the shillbiding is a reality. It just destroys the seriousness of the hobby. In some hours we will all see if this auction goes through and if the last bidders are real. In the end, maybe it will be the case that the last 3 bidders are people who really want the card, and we can confirm they were serious bidders…and that would be a better thing to see 
I don’t think the card will get relisted unless everyone who is really interested in it is in this forum and decides to quit bidding. And that is also only if the bids are fake.
I think the card will be paid for by someone who wants it, they aren’t worried about a few bids that raised the price earlier then expected.
Also, who says this James Tan guy wasn’t going to pay? I never saw him say that, I think a lot of us are prejudice against veribank (I don’t like them either, they are all pretty rude)
This might very well not be a tampered auction at all and we are all hoping for it to be.
100x PSA 10 Charizards…the Pop is like…110? That’s absolutely insane.
I guess if I had come to that point too with that many PSA 10 Charizards passing through my hands that i’d just move heaven and earth to bid $80K on this thing at the end and be done with it. 
I don’t use facebook but from what I’ve seen the guy was flaunting his bid around as if it was a pissing contest. He gave the strong vibe of being a false-bidding troll who seeks his peers approval by showing them a digital number that equates to nothing if you fail to honor it. Then we had other people attempting to “outdo” him by “bidding” more. Even if one of the people was a serious bidder, the mentality of “I’m going to outbid you to make myself look cooler” is a tasteless and destructive one. It shews away serious collectors, harms the reputation of Pokemon, and invalidates the market in many ways.
I would never list such a card as an auction. I don’t understand why anyone would. List it crazy high and take offers.
I don’t believe it was all psa 10 charizards he just said it was 100 of his best psa 10 cards. Maybe some were charizards. Either way to send 100 in your expect 1 or two to come back a 10 but non did. Mean mathematically 0 percent. That’s why BGS 10 is the unicorn of cards and is less then 1 percent in chances to get one. That’s just a 10. A black label is a different story. Black label is in a whole different world. You ever come across a cheap black label pokemon card you buy it. There was a Japanese lugia that passed by a week or so ago. Almost bought it. But decided not to. I’m not a fan of japanese cards that are created into English. If it was a Japanese exclusive I’m all for it.
I agree that it is not appropriate behavior by any means, and I wouldn’t do an auction either.
I guess, I’m just not convinced that it was a fake bid unless he does win and does not pay.
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We are officially under 1 HR.
Best of luck to all. Hope you get your card(s).
Now I wonder will a BGS 10 Shadowless Charizard fetch as much as a 1st ed PSA 10 Charizard, or more?
Did anyone on here win it?
55.6k goodness grashious