I can totally see that viewpoint. I’m an extreme perfectionist, totally familiar with it, just doesn’t apply to owning all the cards in a set specifically in my case.
That being said, I’m mostly familiar with one particular way of chasing cards, and that is by pulling them. Then it becomes very difficult. That is a really good chase to me. I have bought, what, maybe five singles my entire life? 99,9% of my collection comes from sealed stuff.
For example, I 've opened around 150 packs of Jungle 1st ed, still no Venomoth and Clefable holo. The Clefable I couldn’t care less about, but the Venomoth was my first ever Jungle holo, it has a special place in my heart. I can’t get myself to buy the single, because I need the rush of pulling it (will probably end up saying fuck it and buy the damn single though, haha).
There’s a reason why many people (myself included) near exclusively collect set cards. Set cards are nostalgic and relevant in a way that most promos aren’t.
It is a very big factor, but artistic value is more important. I can’t relate to your example, so let me use one of my own; I’d much rather take a Mew black star promo 9 than the beyond ugly Kusube Gengar from Neo Destiny. Not that there is anything more arbitrary about collecting pieces of a set than there is collecting cards you have an artistic appreciation of. It’s a multitude of perspectives.
As for release history, that is precisely the point. The card comes from an official set with a very specific pedigree; an expansion, something available in boosters, something I can pull, something designed to go together (even if you don’t like all the pieces), the meat and potatoes of the TCG. Not something given out in happy meals like a free hotdog on the 4th of July.
The method of procuring the item can become very relevant when your collecting is directly tied with how you procure them. I put a premium on set cards because, to me, they have a distinct place above other cards. Some people feel the opposite way, hence trophy collectors, promo collectors etc.
@c0ll3ct0r thanks a lot for your thourough perspective! Really helped me to understand your position better. Also respect to you for opening almost every card you have by yourself, that’s some serious dedication! Good luck on your future pulls
I’m positive that I’m going to piss off some people with this opinion, but I guess that means that it’s well suited for this thread? lol
But I think that the modern-era of Pokemon cards is going to turn out like the ‘junk wax’ era in sports cards. The circumstances are astonishingly similar:
The ‘junk wax’ era dawned when people began to invest in modern sports cards. People began to invest in modern sports cards once the older sports cards started to become valuable. People expected the modern cards to follow suit.
This newfound demand from investors drove card production up significantly. Not only this, but investors were adults who hoarded lots of sealed product and carefully preserved the cards they opened.
This lead to market saturation that still persists to this day. The cards from the late 80s/early 90s are still basically worthless. There’s a good amount of genuine demand for them – they’re nostalgic for many people. But because investor demand drove the print runs up and because adults kept lots of product sealed, the market has experienced long-term saturation.
I don’t think I need to highlight the similarities with modern Pokemon product. It’s pretty obvious. Will modern Pokemon become akin to the junk wax era? Only time will tell. But what is clear is that the reason why WotC/EX Series is expensive is precisely the reason why modern product won’t be:
People didn’t hoard, for instance, sealed Skyridge or EX Deoxys boxes. So the supply of sealed product is tiny relative to the amount printed.
These were mass-produced sets, but the people collecting these cards were almost exclusively kids. And kids don’t treat cards like adults do. And even then, kids in 2003 didn’t have the same interest in preserving cards as kids do now. I had no clue or interest in what my cards were worth. And I made zero effort to preserve them. I carried my favorite card (Dragonite ex from EX Dragon) in my pocket to school everyday. Needless to say: the supply of mint raw cards from vintage sets is super low relative to the amount of these cards printed.
Low supply of mint raw cards + low supply of sealed product = WotC/EX Series are organically collectible
Anyway, I’m sure I’ll piss off many people here who have money invested in modern cards. But this is just my honest view of things. If you’re going to flame me for ‘hating on Modern’ and lob ad hominens at me, then don’t bother. I’ve heard it all before. But if you want to have a reasoned, civil discussion, though, then I’m fine with that.
yea it’s really largely in TCPI’s hands. They (I’m sure) are well aware of the junk wax era and how detrimental that was to the sports cards industry as a whole and you would think there would be intelligent enough analysts and foresight within the company to see that short term profits now are not better than a longterm sustainable hobby. The pull rates are still pretty tough on some of the new stuff (rainbow chonky @ like 1/1100 packs or something) so at least they haven’t made them trivially easy to obtain but I do agree when you look at pop reports like we’ll just say champion’s path (2020).
Vmax/full art: 1286 10, 373 9V/full art: 1152 10, 367 9
go back to even 4 yrs ago (2016), Evolutions Charizard-holo: 162 9, 3622 10
is it just easier to grade now because of improved production quality? is literally just every person ripping, sealing, and shipping direct to PSA?
Again I think the big question is how much will TCPI print. Imho I would much rather pay a premium per box but have them hard to get. Not everybody agrees with that, but I would rather have them underprint and suffer the retail premiums than have them overprint and have literally everything in this period be 100% worthless.
Tough line to walk though because underprint too much and people lose interest because they can’t get it and they can’t participate in the hobby anymore. Very weird spot to be in, I have no idea the ‘right’ answer. I hope it’s not the junk wax era
The quality has not gotten better. Why is PSA so backlogged? Modern. Modern sports and modern Pokemon. People are indeed breaking boxes and packs and submitting right away because theres this new wave of pseudo investorship in Pokemon that is new. Older people have had collections a long time. But modern people who are just getting into it are treating it like a get rich quick scheme, that is misguided obviously.
As others have already said, I don’t think this is as unpopular as you think. It’s as you say: as a kid I’d play with the cards on a weekly basis (sometimes even on a daily basis), and all cards from my youth are LP at best.
I don’t have a single sealed product from that time. Why? Because I was a kid! If you get a booster pack as a 7 y.o. kid from your parents, you obviously open it. I never used sleeves, and I organized my entire Pokémon collection differently every few months taking my entire collection out of their binder, and putting it in differently.
If we compare that to now, there are obviously still kids that do the same. But at the same time, all of us and many other adults see how much value is in Pokémon, and start buying and saving sealed stuff.
I’m a collector and primarily buy. I’m even too lazy to start selling my duplicated cards, unless it’s to friends (I will soon™, though). But even I have bought a few boxes to keep sealed and sell in the distant future these last couple of years. All these investors right now do the same. The amount of sealed booster boxes for sets like XY Evolutions is incomparable to a set like Jungle. Back then, Pokémon had only just started. And sure, there are a lot of people who at THAT time were adults and had experience with other collectibles, so they saw the potential and future value in Pokémon, even though it was still a risk for them at the time. Well, those few people that invested back in 1999/2000 definitely made the correct decision when you see today’s market, that’s for sure.
But let’s fast forward ten years from now. Sure, all the booster boxes and other sealed products that are released this year will definitely have increased in value, I have no doubt about that. But it wouldn’t even nearby be worth as much as the WotC era products are worth now. At least, based on the current amount of people saving these boxes because they know it will increase in value, I’d say it most likely won’t. Obviously I can’t predict the future.
To give a more concrete example: XY era booster boxes aren’t worth that much right now. Yet those sets were released two Pokémon eras ago, over six years ago. If I look at recent sold listings of XY era booster boxes on eBay, XY Evolutions (the final XY release, which has been reprinted -again- last month) is selling for the most with ~400-500 USD right now, but most of the other XY era boxes sell for 200-450 USD.
On the flipside of things however, this year has also managed to surprise us with the opposite. We know thousands of people saved their XY Evolution booster boxes when that set was first released. For the last four years, the price was roughly the same. But only these last few months the market has gone crazy, and even these boxes shot up to 400-500 USD.
So yeah, even if everything you say is true and I agree with it, we never know what the future may hold. One thing is for sure, I don’t think anyone could have foreseen what happened this year with both the world in general and Pokémon market. We live in weird times for sure, and I’m curious where the future may bring us.
Calling cards or sets overrated won’t make the cards you own worth more.
All holos and secret rares should be at the start of a set. Modern sets blending holos, full arts, and non-holos make them look ridiculous in binders. Dark Raichu should have been at the front of the set.
3.Modern cards should use thicker card stock, or they will always feel like cheap garbage.
Using the term “underrated” is cringe and anytime I hear someone talking about “this card is underrated”, I am stopping the video and unsub from the channel. Not interested in being part of the market manipulation.
Important to note though that I see a difference between “underrated” and “underappreciated”, and I fully respect usage of the later term, as it not neccesarily connected to the monetary value but rather the general awarness of (the history) of the card.
I like Pokémon and it was part of my childhood. HOWEVER, when I think about it, the whole concept is about making living creatures beat each other up for glory of their owner and they basically live in a cage in a form of a Pokéball. That is kinda sad and would be interesting to see how future generations will perceive this, as the environmental and animal abuse awarness in on the rise. (Not trying to sounds serious, just a thought)
PSA case on the modern era set cards is more valuable than the cardboard inside.
[Edit: added *set* in the last point, as I should make it more clear that I still find some non-set modern era promos valuable, especially the Japanese ones]
Overrated and underrated isn’t always about money, however the two often go hand-in-hand.
As an example I personally think the Swablu card from Champion’s Path had the best artwork and would very much call that an underrated card, but that doesn’t mean I think it should ever be worth any more than its weight in cardboard - it’s just a pretty card.
I would just use the term “underappreciated” for your Swablu example, otherwise I think we have the same view on this.
For example, one of my most favourite artworks is the Geodude-Graveler-Golem line from Fossil. I think Himeno did an amazing job on those cards. Do I think they are “underrated”? I don’t think they will and should ever sell for thousands of dollars. Do I think they are “underappreciated”? Absolutely!
Like you said its a difficult decision and a fine line to walk between. People are upset at scalpers and the inability to find the products they want to buy. I think its also important that kids be able to find and buy pokemon cards instead of just a ton of grown men hoarding all the product. Is it the right thing to print more to meet demand long term? Only time will tell but short term it’s definitely in Pokemons favor.
Kid for Christmas: All I want is is some Pokemon cards
47 year old Jeremy who is single with no kids: I just spent a new car on buying out the 15th walmart in a 70 mile radius of every single piece of branded Pokemon merchandise they had so that I can make a 13% profit in 9 years
Lol, I can definitely see kids 10-20 years from now getting back into pokemon as young adults like many of us and getting back into the sets from their childhood and discovering hidden fates for the first time because they didn’t even know it existed.
