Interesting aspect. How would one even determine the use of windex when there is no difference to the naked eye, you would have to check every card with chemicals in order to find out the use of it, and even if so why would it be a thing when it isn´t making any difference. It would be interesting to know for how long the card shop owner is doing this procedure and if he detected any noticeable defect/negative impact after a longer period of time.
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Collecting condition is collecting organic condition. This is why PSA doesn’t grade square cuts and many other potential alterations. Hence why I commented earlier, “This thread truly highlights the perceived value of a grade”.
Collecting condition is also inherently subjective. That subjectivity continues to grow with time. Years ago hand cut, customs, cleaning cards didn’t exist. Hell fake cards were barely relevant. Whenever there is more money, there is always a new and improved way to get that money.
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maybe after many days in a row of consistent windex use on the same card? I know what you’re saying, but honestly give it a try on a $5 card. Once you see it with your own eyes, I think most doubts will be put to rest. It’s such a small amount of windex on the cloth. Don’t douse it. A quick wipe and by the time you go to have a look the windex will already be evaporated. Maybe if somebody was really worried they could use a mixture of water and windex. But I honestly think the chance of water leaving a residue or having an abrasive in it, is far greater than the risk of damaging your card with a quick little wipe of windex. Do me the favour of giving it a try. Honestly. Cheap card, micro fibre cloth, windex. And let me know. Lol
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I’m sure you would if it was completely undetectable and sitting in a PSA or BGS case with a nice high grade lol.
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How can a card that’s been gently cleaned, be put in the same category as hand cut, or custom cards. Honestly? I know what you’re saying, but this is not the same thing lol. Not only that, but this has nothing to do with money. This has to do with me wanting this poor card to be free of the two massive fingerprints a previous owner had put in it. It really bugged me. I’m not running some card cleaning operation and pumping out 10’s by whiping windex on all my cards 
. The point of this thread was simply to share my experience. I think my original thread post reads pretty harmlessly. But if course the minute I mention BGS the thread explodes. Lol.
In comic book grading, they use a certain type of UV light that makes foreign chemicals illuminate. Super easy and quick to do with any and every card or book that is graded. I would bet the chemicals may even be detectable through the case under the correct lighting setup…
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Has nothing to do with money… come on dude. You literally went and bought cheap cards to test this idea, you are conscious of the value. Doubt you are cleaning any ratattas.
Alterations are a slippery slope. This is definitely an alteration. Whether you feel its not as bad as corner cutting or whatever is up to you, but it is still an alteration. Kudos though for sharing this information so people know the card was cleaned.
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If I knew that the card was cleaned with windex or anything else, I would not want the card.
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It may be “completely undetectable” at first, but who knows, the ammonia or other harsh chemicals in the windex might start to discolor or damage the holo over time. I know the windex evaporates off the card Immediately, but it might leave behind chemicals you can’t see.
Just my opinion though man, I’m just saying I personally wouldn’t want a card cleaned with windex, you do you though!
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let’s make this clear Scott. Cleaning and altering are different things. Let’s say I find an antique in somebody’s garden. Is it considered altering if I hose the dirt off? Really? Lol. Cleaning my card with windex or water for that mater isn’t going to change any of the other defects on it. It simply cleaned off a scummy fingerprint that was sitting on the surface. It doesn’t sound like anybody could change your mind on this. But the logic behind your opinion is flawed. So you get a raw card and there’s a little spec of dirt on it?? Your not gonna flick it off??? There’s no difference here. My surface just happened to be more sensitive, and my finger happened to be a cloth and a little bit of non abrasive cleaner. Lol
Wiping off a piece of dirt with your hand is organically removing something from a card.
Consciously using a chemical, to the point of testing it on other cards, is an inorganic alteration.
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If the cleaning changed the gloss surface to make it shine more than a factory card, it could and probably should be considered altered, but I’m not stating that’s the case here.
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I am just saying the distinction is made with cleaning comic books that water is acceptable whereas foreign added chemicals no matter how little, is detectable and is labeled as such…
I clean my cards with a plastic dental pic, a q-tip, and some water. Makes them look nicer in my binders or in photos for eBay. I don’t think it should be regarded as alterations however if the Windex does alter the card in some way I can see it being classified as such.
Water works fine with stains and fingerprints I’m really surprised you would risk using chemicals.
I feel like an alteration in terms of a collectable card should be defined. Anyone want to create the definition in their own words?
@nanger9, The idea is simple: People collecting condition are buying organic condition. Most cards graded don’t have windex on them. Therefore adding chemicals of any kind is inherently entering a subjective space. Hence why I initially commented about the subjectivity of collecting condition.
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An Overview of Comic Book Restoration
Repairing comic books has been around in our hobby since the first comics were sold to the public. It is natural for people to want their books to look as new as possible or to remain intact so that they can continue to be read. Early in fandom history, simple and crude repairs were performed by the owner of the comic for these reasons. For example, a couple of pieces of tape were used to hold on the cover, a dab of Dad’s wood glue was used to close a tear, some crayon made the cover look better, etc. As the hobby grew and comics became more expensive, the need to define and describe various repairs became apparent. Some repairs remained acceptable to collectors and were “grandfathered,” such as tape. Most repairs, however, were defined as restoration.
Restoration can be broken down into two main types: treatments intended to prolong the existence of the comic book and treatments done for aesthetics. Both types of restoration involve the introduction of non-original material to create or facilitate a desired effect.
CGC defines restoration as treatments intended to return the comic book to a known or assumed state through the addition of non-original material.
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This is directly from CGC the comic book grading company. Not that it necessarily applies to card grading but the general idea and hobby evolution could be similar…
I totally agree with you Scott😉
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Absolutely right. Even cleaning restoration in slabbed copies can now be detected.
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It’s the same with coins and you lose like 90% value if it’s altered/cleaned even if it looks Mint.
I’m honestly just surprised OP didn’t try wiping off the fingerprints with some water. I would never use any chemicals on my cards.
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