I noticed that Charizard sets such as Darkness Ablaze, Brilliant Stars, Obsidian Flames and other zard sets dont perform as good as other non zard sets. Fusion Strike, Chilling Reign, Lost Origin, Silver Tempest, Crown Zenith and other sets are all more expensive and out performing all the zard sets. Could be because of the diversity of the set but I feel like Brilliant Stars has so many other great cards aside from the 6 charizards they have. Eevee sets destroy zard sets price wise. Is Charizard no longer king?
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I think Charizard has been overused, with a lot of people calling the Pokemon overrated. I know this is gonna turn into EVOLVING skies talk so I’ll use it for comparison: Evolving skies actually wasn’t the best set at first, so now when it rises up, people are going to say Eevee sets are king (which is true FOR NOW, seeing as prismatic is doing well.) Eevee is getting the spotlight for this year, and there’s a pretty good reason why
Most S&V Charizard sets lacked variety. Obsidian flames was a decent set but even before the hype I never saw anything interesting out of it besides some beautiful full arts (cleffa is a good example).
BUT (MAJOR BUT) The mega evolution set is going to probably change this. Mega Charizard X and Y were always extremely popular, and I think with the new mega evolution set, Charizard will most likely become king again. We’ve seen this from XY Flashfire, with the M Charizard X being the top chase in the set.
I’m pretty certain that Charizard is definetly gonna be the star of the show for Mega Symposium and Symphony.
Kinda a lot to unpack and a lot will just be my opinion:
All of those Charizard sets are relatively new and therefore not great to study yet except for darkness ablaze.
I personally don’t start looking at a sets growth until not only is it out of print, but you can’t find random packs of it in tins and misc products. It’s the point where the only people buying it would be collectors so that gets rid of any bias from playability and release hype. This imo mostly applies to brilliant stars since it is just about to enter that period. While the others are newer.
Most of the Charizard premium we see is coming because older, wealthier collectors relate to Charizard through nostalgia. It’s clear that just slapping something that pokemon tells us is Charizard into a set doesn’t work. Vmax Charizard is an abomination that has no nostalgia to an old school Charizard fan outside of the name. That essentially weeds out sets where we have strange Charizard gimmicks like obsidian and darkness. Some Charizard fans will be down for anything Pokemon gives them but not enough to make the set an instant hit. It’s possible in 10 years we look back with some nostalgia to these forms, but Charizard will have at least 2-3 new forms by then and I can’t imagine them being uglier. The only reason mega Charizard works is because it is a good looking Pokemon that Charizard fans old and new agree on.
If you look back at older sets, most of the ones that contain a Charizard are considered “better” sets for their era. Except for stuff like base set 2, which again, didn’t sit well with collectors and was considered lazy and dumb (like how older collectors view crystal crowns and some Vmax designs). In fact there are arguments to be made from people like me who like Charizard, but don’t really hold it to God tier status as a species that many sets like neo revelation > neo destiny. But will that ever be the general consensus? Nope, because in my generation Charizard was too iconic to be anything less than the best.
Base
Team rocket
Gym challenge
Neo destiny
Skyridge
Dragon
Dragon frontiers
Secret wonders
Stormfront
Supreme victors
Plasma storm
Of this list of Charizard chase sets, all are considered to be top tier in their respective eras. And I only skipped maybe 5 or so vintage sets that contain Charizard that were considered mid at worst. As nostalgia drops for new collectors who is to say they need to relate to Charizard? The damand comes back because from time to time a modern Charizard will tickle the collector bug in vintage Charizard fans and they will shell out large sums for it. Thus everyone wants in, and Pokemon decides to give people what they think they want.
Darkness and obsidian lack any sort of chase outside of Charizard. So remove the older collectors interest due to the Charizards being hella uggo, and you’re left with new collectors ripping to hit one card that may have no nostalgia to them and is lacking a lot of the stonk dogger press that would inflate the set. This isn’t a great recipe for success or set growth.
I do believe brilliant is a different story as it has a more standard Charizard that old and new fans can appreciate, but imo it’s still too new to really speak about yet.
Again, my opinion. As someone who likes Charizard, but is happy to admit it’s a big Pokemon world and he’s not what he used to be.
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Well, Obsidian Flames is doing pretty good. It’s actually a top 5 Scarlet & Violet set, despite it’s smallness.
Darkness Ablaze is just plain bad. It has no good cards, much the same as Rebel Clash and the Base Set, with the difference that those sets were printed a lot less.
As for Brilliant Starts, it lacks a beautiful chase card. Yes, it has the Charizard, but in my opinion (and I’m guessing the opinion of more people) it’s just not a very good Charizard card. The set is still doing better than sets like Astral Radiance and, for now, Silver Tempest though.
So, I think Charizard still gives a premium to a set. But, it cannot make a very bad set good.
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I think obsidian flames is a fun set to open, but it’s kinda boring after a while. Maybe it was just a small set.
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Yeah, it really has two sides to it. On the one hand it is awesome that it’s very possible to pull the SIR Charizard (I pulled it twice). A lot better than opening Fusion Strike or Chilling Reign and pulling absolutely nothing. On the other hand, you start pulling doubles very quick.
I forgot to mention Evolutions XY. It has about 5 or 6 charizards in it. Although just reprints from different eras its still should be considered a zard set seeing how many are packed in there.
I also think that comparing an eevee set to a zard set is very tedious just because there are so many eeveelutions compared to one charizard. Charizard is holding the world on his back alone with no back-up or counterparts (except mega zard). And the fact that the eevee artworks that are coming out are just really beautiful artworks. Thats why 151 is a top tier set and can compete with the eevee sets and all other sets, its because charizard has backup and isnt rolling alone (blastoise, venusaur, charmander, charmeleon, etc). And because that zard is just a beautiful artwork. Iconic.
Its not really fair to compare 9 eeveelutions with beautiful artworks to one Charizard with a beautiful artwork. By default there would be more interest in 9 beautiful artworks in a set than one artwork in another set.
Edit: And I wouldnt consider 151 a zard set. Just an example I used.
Evolutions shouldn’t be counted as a Charizard set at all. It has Charizards, but that’s not what MAKES the set.
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I don’t have too much hard data to support this, but to me it feels like Charizard’s popularity is waning. Or at least, the gap between Charizard and other Pokemon is waning. 2020-21 boom really felt like it was Charizard leading the charge with 1st ed base and beyond, but now Charizard cards often aren’t even the most expensive ones in the set (see VSTAR Universe, Shiny Treasure ex/Paldean Fates).
It looks like Pokemon like the Eeveelutions (Umbreon/Espeon/Sylveon especically), Gengar, Rayquaza, Giratina, Lugia, etc. are all rising in popularity. There also seems to be a bigger emphasis on art quality and uniqueness these days as opposed to just what Pokemon is on the card. Kanda/Komiya arts are jumping up because they’re all unique and interesting.
I’ve mentioned this a few times but I agree with @Vertemes, Charizard is a bit overexposed by now. Every generation having a Charizard-headlined set and then more Charizards in special sets has gotten tiring for collectors.
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Charizord fell off for sure
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I was just gonna write a thoughtful response in agreement, about Charizard fatigue and newer enthusiasts not resonating as much with him, but now pfm’s pretty much just summed it up, it would just sound like a bunch of fluffy guff. Dammit pfm
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PFM once again being the absolute goat. Besides Rayquaza of course.
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Ain’t got time for guff, just straight spittin facts n shit
Agreed that Evolutions isn’t a Charizard set, but the Charizard evolutionary line definitely was given preferential treatment.
Squirtle, Bulbasaur, & friends were snubbed and they haven’t forgotten.
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This is definitely correct, Charizard was given all the love and blastoise + Venusaur just got snubbed with 1 ex.
Even big hoss is gonna struggle eventually when every card they print of him looks like complete shit year after year after year.
That’s a bit negative. But yes, after the Base Set Charizard they didn’t get back to that level. And Eeveelutions, Gengar & Rayquaza have moved up.
At the same time, whenever a new era get’s hype, such as the Mega Evolutions now because of the new Mega Sets, guess who leads the pack; Charizard.
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wait till you see mega umbreon
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Let’s hope they never do that. As much as I love Charizard I think that Espeon and Umbreon are the peak of Pokémon design.
And the new Mega Charizard!