Yeah, this is my take as well. The WotC cards are such a distinct period in Pokémon history that they are just bound to get more pull. In the end having something rare is a draw as well.
Let’s be real. If it was truly made solely for children, there wouldn’t be so much emphasis on the art.
And despite Pokemon not being as complicated a TCG (or so I’m told) it’s not really for kids either. What TCG even is?
You like what you like, fine, but let’s not pretend there’s no difference between art by Arita or Komiya (both basically there from the beginning) and Sugimori clip art.
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I think so too, it´s just that they may not have ´really´ looked yet. Another example of this is the secret rare cards from Black & White sets, which a lot of newer people just see as holo´s. Knowing that a card exists, and knowing how awesome it actually is are two different things. You have to ´really´ look.
I don’t think the masses know anything about that and I’m not sure they care beyond 1st edition and not.
I think people are discovering there are lot more ways to collect and not everyone is going to follow the same journey or care to follow it. Let people collect what they want and let’s not try and force a whole path to vintage.
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Forcing? I’m just saying I think some people might follow a similar path that I did. People will collect what they want, and their tastes might change over time, as did mine.
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I don’t think this is entirely true. The market is so vast there are swathes of people that don’t go beyond pack openings or modern. Even minimal exposure could move the needle on many vintage cards. Look at 1st Edition base right now, its had a bump recently, while being one of the most established vintage sets. To dig deeper, I remember halting all my auctions for PSA 10’s as I couldn’t replenish inventory, and figured these were underrated. Here we are, and the cards are 2-4x from when I made that decision.
These type of opportunities or observations will always exist because the market is so vast and varied. Similar to the stock market, there is always something overrated & underrated.
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Vintage certainly wins the higher floor argument IMO.
I feel that the advantage of low pop with vintage cards is that they’re hard(er) to hord/sell off in mass. Because of that, if/when the hype slows down or stagnates, I’d simply can see people deciding to not to sell their rarer stuff versus modern slabs they might be able to pick up again later
However, while hype/demand are going up ad infitimum, modern will have way more cards that have a lot of room to grow for high margins (besides a few holy grail exceptions in vintage).
This is my experience with the market as well. All it takes is one influencer to notice something, and it can result in people ´discovering´ something that they always overlooked because something else was in the spotlight.
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Just collect what you like. If you start focussing too much on the monetary value, it can become a slippery slope as you can end up flip flopping and spending too much money trying to find the safe bets in what are, at the end of the day, still just toys.
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Fair enough 
. From my experience they are generally aware of vintage set cards existence, although they surely fail to pinpoint exact sets, artworks or NEO holos of course.
Don’t forget that many people have been exposed to Pokemon cards during childhood, and collecting/“investing” is mainstream since 2021.
I can totally believe that many newcomers (knowing Pokemon only through PoGo, Switch or Pocket) lack knowledge, and I also agree that the majority of casuals vastly prefer modern. So, we should probably better define what are these masses we are referring to.
My gut feeling is that for now they aren’t truly interested in certain parts of vintage, not because of the lack of knowledge (which is readily available for whoever is motivated enough to check around) but because of the lack of “marketability” (simpler artwork, not enough low pop, not popular species, already boomed during covid, and so on..).
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I don’t think they have been toys for a long long time.
Kids view them as collectables just as adults do. Every LGS and show has kids asking for slabs, grading, polishing, pressing, value, etc etc.
It’s actually a topic I’ve been thinking about a lot and I wanted to recommend it to @lyleberr for a qotd - when did Pokemon cards stop becoming toys?
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Indeed. Define “future”.
You could similarly say that in the FAR future, only vintage will exist. As the sun sets on the final days of planet earth, all modern will be vintage, and hopefully, only the art will be remembered.
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modern >
Yes exactly this! If Pokémon does stop making new games and new cards, modern won’t be the cool thing anymore. It would be 50 years worth of cards and the next generation will decide what is worthwhile
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And I would add, to actually contribute, before I disappear back into my walkabout, that once there is no modern, the current vintage will reign, as today’s modern will be found in every person’s closet.
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I don’t see it as a silly argument. I think I would prefer vintage art if I had to pick, BUT I can easily understand why one would make the case for modern. Modern has such an array of different artists and styles. There are so many unique looking cards coming out every couple months. Artists really are pushing the bar for just how creative one can get applying art onto cardboard.
I don’t think it’s a coincidence that up-and-coming artists (in the Pokemon TCG space) are creating buzz and in turn expensive cards that people are chasing. Shinji Kanda is a great example of art being the focal point. Some of their arts have included somewhat less popular Pokemon, and people are still willing to pay a premium for it.
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Sure, it has evolved into serious collectables, but its still a toy or at least toy-related at its core.
My point here though is that I think its financially safer to enjoy the hobby without somehow getting too dependent on it as an investment vehicle. So referring to it as a “toy” helps ground it to hopefully make that point come across stronger.
This is my take as well. At the moment, these simpler artworks just don´t really appeal to the average modern fan. I disagree about the not low enough POP´s though. Allmost all of these cards have POP´s of under 250 in a 10, with many of the Neo cards even below 75.
An example is the Neo Discovery Scizor. In a 1st edition it goes for about 4K in a 10, with a POP of only 41. Scizor is very popular. What´s more, this is the first artwork.
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modern loses coz no one is gonna remember whatever crap that comes out now in 20 years
whereas everyone knows what the original base set charizard and pikachu look like even ur mother and grandmother 
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I think it probably should be considered a toy and it’s definitely healthier, but I just don’t see that as the case anymore at all. Even for little kids.
When we were all kids we didn’t know or care about value and condition. Now 6 year olds want PSA 10s and they wanna sell it for full market price
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