@tyronebiggums ok, I see what you’re getting at. U kind of went off on a couple tangents that didn’t really make sense to me lol but I agree 100% with what you just said with regards to selling risk and time required. And it’s certainly much riskier to invest in pokemon cards versus in the stock market assuming you’re well diversified and don’t have all your money in a few high risk penny stocks haha. I mean just look at the volatility of Pokémon cards and that should give you insight to the risk right there. High risk can reap the highest rewards and losses as we’ve seen recently.
You seem a bit offended, because you went out of your way to register for this forum just to post on this thread lol. That said, I generally agree with you.
But, on the other side of the coin, I understand why people feel the need to justify their spending exorbitant amounts of money on Pokemon. People are overextending themselves precisely because they feel that Pokemon cards, in addition to being something that they genuinely desire, are going to hold (if not appreciate in) value. I think that people shouldn’t overextend to purchase Pokemon cards, but at the same time I entirely understand why some people feel the need to justify it to themselves and others. Ultimately, though, it’s not any different than any other collecting hobby. Some people approach collecting with a sense of financial responsibility and foresight, and others don’t. Because Pokemon collectors are younger and generally don’t have access to significant amounts of capital, you see a higher concentration of financially reckless people than in other collecting hobbies.
Very few people, though, are approaching Pokemon collecting with the perspective that you describe – principally, people collect Pokemon cards because they love them. If there were large concentrations of people involved in Pokemon purely for the money, then I’d, as you have, advise them to go elsewhere. But I don’t think that’s the case with almost anyone (at least certainly not on this forum). So I don’t see a point in trying to convince a bunch of collectors that what they love collecting likely isn’t bound to provide the optimal RoI – if it’s a consideration at all, it’s secondary.
I didnt go off on any tangents. I think you just read what you wanted to read lol. I was pretty clear on what I was trying to get across. In the first post I said if you like Pokemon collecting cards that there isn’t anything wrong with it.
It’s just stupid when people want to come up with reasons to justify why it’s a financially sound idea. It’s like people that buy sports cars. Sports cars are obviously a waste of money, but are very fun. But if your rich, who gives a crap if its a waste of money? I would say the same with Pokemon cards. If you have a good paying job and like Pokemon cards, then buy them to your heart’s content. However, if your trying to send your kids to college on them, your going to be in a world of pain.
With all due respect I think your projecting a bit here. You sound more offended than you claim that I am. I made an account to educate people on all the misinformation that Im reading on here. Im not offended by people talking BS. If anything, I find it a combo of laughable and sad that there are tons of people out there who think this makes financial sense. Some of this info is dangerous since there will be people out there who know absolutely nothing about what to do with their money and think that pouring their money into Pokemon cards is going to take care of their family.
If too many people “invested” into Pokemon, it would be beanie babies 2.0. If adults overtook kids in this hobby then a bubble would occur and it would eventually burst. That is another major risk to collectables. I already see it happening in Magic the Gathering with more “investors” than actual players. At a point, the bubble bursts since nobody can unload their stuff and everything becomes worthless.
*For some reason the word “bub-ble” keeps becoming bubble LOL Not sure why the website coding keeps doing that but I mean world bub-ble
How did anything I say indicate that I was offended? Did you read what I wrote? Because you didn’t respond to a single point I made. You realize that I mostly agree with you, right?
My point is that there are almost no people who approach Pokémon as only investors. People who buy Pokémon cards buy them at least partially (usually mostly) due to sincere interest in the cards. So, in effect, you’re trying to convince a bunch of collectors of a consideration that isn’t the most relevant to them. It’s not irrelevant, but it’s secondary to the actual pursuit of collecting for collecting’s sake.
@tyronebiggums this entire paragraph you said is either irrelevant or not true. “The reason why I think investing in trading cards so dumb is because there is no super wealthy people on the planet who do it. Nobody serious about making money does this kind of stuff. You don’t see any major financial firms or anyone in Forbes billionaires list that got rich by buying up the right Pokémon cards and sitting on them for 20+ years. Its just a terrible idea if you care about making money. Go do a start up or create a business if you want to invest into something worth doing. Buying a bunch of cardboard and holding it for 10-20 years has never been a success story of anyone worth while.”
Just because financial firms and super wealthy people don’t do it doesn’t mean it’s a bad investment. It’d be impossible for a financial firm or billionaire to take a worthwhile position in pokemon due to the small size of the market, lack of availability and it’s extremely high risk. Buying a bunch of cardboard and holding it for 10-20 years is a success story for literally multiple people on this exact forum you’re on lol. Even people who bought recently have seen returns on investment that would take decades to accomplish in the stock market. It really depends on what your definition of “bad investment” is and it seems to me like yours is one of extremely high risk, which is fair, but doesn’t necessarily make it a bad investment. Everyone has their own risk tolerance. Those reasons you listed are either irrelevant or don’t make it a bad investment, rather a high risk one.
Edit: I also love the comment telling people to go do a start up lmao. I think something like 90% of startups fail and result in a serious amount of lost capital and time, but I don’t want to go off on my own tangent here
Well for one, when I say “I think”, that would be an opinion. That isn’t me claiming a fact.
But two, yeah I would think that is true though. Most wealthy people don’t look at collectables as investments. To them it’s a hobby. None of them got rich over hoarding stuff like that. Most of their wealth was created either through their businesses, stocks, bonds, or other investment funds. None of them made their money off collectibles, let alone trading cards.
And you can’t tell me with a straight face that Pokemon cards are a better investment than Nintendo stock. It’s literally investing in the same exact thing except that Pokemon cards are shinnier and better to look at, which I GET IT, that is FUN, but if your talking about numbers, it just makes more sense to buy stock in a company that you like instead of investing in their products due to the liquidity and other risks.
Sorry I missed that part about you agreeing with me. You said I was offended, which I am not. I’m not on the defense since I’m not the one who has to defend the idea that investing in Pokemon cards is a good financial idea. I’m just against the idea that people who collect something as a hobby need a reason to do it. They don’t. They don’t need to justify speculating on a commodity since that is more what buying Pokemon cards is similar to. It’s not really an investment. There is no entity that your investing into. Your betting on the idea that Pokemon will still be around 20 years from now. If money was the main thing at play here, then Nintendo stock is better since Pokemon is what is keeping Nintendo alive.
@tyronebiggums I think you’re blurring the lines between a bad investment and a high risk investment and using them interchangeably when you shouldn’t be. I agree w some of the things you said but don’t agree with some of the reasons behind what makes it a “bad” investment. Everyone has their own opinion though.
Collectibles tend to share qualities of both though. High risk since anything can happen to Pokemon in the next 20 years and a bad investment to to liquidity issues and doesn’t always beat inflation.
Regardless, my point is that buy Pokemon cards if your well off and want to enjoy them. Do not buy them as a “investment” thinking that it will be your retirement fund. And for the most part, they share more qualities with commodities that your speculating on over a regular investment.
“Investing” is the action of putting money into something in the hopes that it will grow through the future. If you bought $10,000 worth of WOTC Pokemon cards in January, you made much more profit than you would have if you invested in $10,000 in Nintendo.
I think you are trying to state in your examples that Nintendo Stock is “safer”. I do not believe ANYONE would argue that Pokemon is more risk. You have to remember that many people will risk more for potential higher reward.
The thing you are missing or focusing too much is all this noisy arguments. People who can be “wealthy” because of pokemon cards don’t even “invest” or pay attention to that stuff, they just do it and thats it. They might know is risky or there are better alternatives, they just do it because they like it (considering all the risks).
That’s why certain people built some wealth out of it. None of those thought x years ago " well, i’m going to do this solely for investment expecting gains". And yes as you said, as hobby grows these kind of behaviors are bound to be more common and more speculators will join the hobby but still, thing is doing it because you like it, is fun and you can make SOME cash out of it, awesome. Some outliers can make lots of money but certainly, those outliers are very knowledgeable of the market and have an actual passion for the hobby.
Thats not really what investing is. Investing is contributing to an entity or a fund in order to help it grow so that your paid back in the future. Investing is more like giving someone a loan and getting it paid back in interest. Collectibles arent really investments, even if people call them that. They are more similar to commodities in that they are regular things that people buy and fluxuate in value. And Pokemon “investing” is closer to speculation since nobody knows the future of the franchise. Not to mention that trading cards are an unregulated market with lots of market manipulation. Tons of people out there who intentially inflate prices and inventory levels online.
And no, you wouldn’t have made more money off WoTC cards since you probably would have had to invest a ton of time flipping the cards. Plus the stress of dealing with crazies on ebay, potential damages / lost items in the mail, some inventory not moving, etc. You only make more money when you fully cash out and cashing out is a TON of labor. Most people on this site look like they are never going to cash out, hence they never made any money doing this.
All investing is speculative. You’re probably right, no way stocks nor any other investments could be manipulated.
As for the second paragraph, investing is typically LONG term… so those people not cashing out would have investments. By that I am saying if they DID cash out, they would have huge profit margins IF the cards they had went up in value from the original purchase date. Hence… it was a great investment
Stocks and other financial instruments have laws protecting people. You can go to jail for manipulating those markets. The cops arent coming to your house if your manipulating the Pokemon market LOL. If you get scammed on ebay and try to report to the police, they will laugh and not even bother. eBay tells you its a cost of doing business and your screwed if someone decides to scam you.
And stocks, bonds, etc. are a much easier investment. Maybe you could have made more money off WoTC Pokemon if you cashed out on every single thing, but there is way more stress and work involved. I can tell alot of people on this site never cashed out / will never since they seem to have no clue what you have to deal with to do so.
If people know what I mean then I dont need to change anything. Also its not only safer, but way less work. Cashing out of your Pokemon cards is a job in itself.
@tyronebiggums, As someone who is prepping to sell a classic card, I can say that cashing out pokemon is a breeze haha.
Obviously clicking a button to “close position” is easier. Selling pokemon cards isn’t that hard.
Selling 1 card is completely different than trying to liquidate a mass collection. Its not easy at all. As someone who has worked with shops and done some of my own flipping on the side, its alot of work.
speaking a liquidating a mass collection. I am some what of an expert in that haha.
If you go through PWCC or another auction house its’ actually fairly easy. It’ll take 2-3 months
to get the funds. However, as I said before it’s really not that difficult.
