CGC Damaged card, trying to determine next steps

[wjames]

Hi guys,

I recently bought a CGC 9.5 on ebay. From pictures it seems good, but when it arrived there was some damage to the top left edge (see pics). The damage that it has looks like it happened during the encapsulation process. I contacted CGC and they said there is no way to tell how the damage occured and are trying to tell me that it could have happened AFTER the card was encapsulated, so they cannot rectify the issue

To me, this is ridiculous as its impossible for the edge to be bent like that while its in the case, so clearly they mis graded it or it was damaged during the encapsulation.

How should I proceed with this? I’ve been in contact with CGC but they are denying everything.

https://imgur.com/a/8RZCQS0

[zorloth]

Two possibilities:

1. It was misgraded
2. It was damaged during the encapsulation process

Either way, it’s CGC’s fault and they should make it right. Personally, though, I’d just resell the card, disclose the damage, and take the loss. Grading companies are known for rarely taking responsibility for issues like this and it’s probably not going to be worth your time to deal with. I have a lot of CGC 9.5s and I’ve never encountered an issue like this, so luckily this is probably a rare occurrence.

[hypernova]

Your best bet is probably to do a return via eBay if you feel that the damage is unacceptable for the grade and the damage was not visible, described, or even obscured. The seller probably did not see the damage when processing the card for listing. You’re probably right that the edge was slightly damaged during encapsulation, but it’s also not surprising that CGC does not want to take ownership of the damage.

These situations are not fun for anybody, but you as the buyer of the card do not need to be stuck holding the bag if the damage was not apparent from the listing pictures or description.

Just as a heads up, many of the people on the forum here are eBay sellers (including myself), so there is a bit of a group bias that will suggest buyers should almost always be responsible for these kind of situations. The argument goes: the grading company gave this card the grade, you purchased the card with that grade, that’s what the seller shipped you, therefore you have no grounds for a return and should just keep the card (or resell it yourself at a loss). My personal opinion in an encapsulation damage case like this is that the responsibility chain goes CGC → Seller → Buyer. It’s likely CGC’s fault, so they should be responsible for fixing the issue. Failing that, the next in the chain should be the seller that appropriately discloses the damage and sells it with the buyer knowing and accepting that the damage is there. Again, if it’s not a very high value card, it’s likely that the seller did not even see the damage was there to begin with, and good sellers would want to make it right with you if that’s the case by either providing you with an acceptable partial refund or accepting the return outright.

[pfm]

I’m curious what CGC actually said to you. This looks like a pretty straightforward situation. Is the damage visible in their scans?

[jabby]

It’s a little hard to tell:

I do recall someone on here having a story of doing a re-holder with PSA where the card got damaged and PSA said it’s still the same grade, and they didn’t take responsibility for it seemed.

Sucks to have this happen for sure.

[wjames]

this is what they said:

" Unfortunately, we can not say when this damage occurred. Whether it was in transit to the original owner or after they had sold this collectible we can not say. If you would like you can submit this card to us under our free reholder service to have the grade corrected, but this damage happened after it had left our facility and was not reported to us. You can review the images of this card after encapsulation HERE.

If you would like to have this returned and the grade corrected, please utilize our new, self-serve Mechanical Error feature on the Online Submission form to return your item for correction. Simply select Mechanical Error as your service and follow the directions to retrieve your shipping label. Please let us know if you have any additional questions."

Basically that it was damaged after it left the facility, which is hilarious. They want me to return to them for mechanical error, re sub and get a new lower grade with zero compensation. Which is a joke since they clearly caused the damage.

1. Clerical or Mechanical Errors.

A clerical or mechanical error occurs when a Collectible is encapsulated with a label that bears a grade and/or description that clearly does not correspond with the Collectible. It is the duty of the buyer and seller of a Collectible to examine such Collectible for a clerical or mechanical error and to return such Collectible for correction when warranted. This Guarantee does not apply when Guarantor determines, in its sole reasonable discretion, that a clerical or mechanical error has resulted in the Collectible having an incorrect grade or description. If requested, any clerical or mechanical errors will be remedied free of charge by updating the encapsulation to show an appropriate label.

CGC certification labels with incorrect dates, issue numbers, and card types (all of which should be obvious to someone who performs an inspection of the Collectible and label) or obviously incorrect grades are considered clerical or mechanical errors. Examples of such errors include, but are not limited to, the following:

1. A comic book label description references issue 52, when the comic book actually has an issue number of 82.
2. A magazine label description references a 2005 issue date when the magazine cover is actually dated 2010.
3. A trading card is graded 10 when it should have been graded 1, a clerical error with respect to grade that would be obvious to a collector.Owners and prospective buyers of CGC-certified Collectibles are encouraged to enter the Collectible’s CGC certification number in the Verify CGC Certification section of the CGC website to confirm a Collectible’s grade and description and, for some Collectibles, view images of the Collectible. If CGC becomes aware that a Collectible was encapsulated with a label that bears a clerical or mechanical error, it will correct the error in its records and display the correct grade and/or description for that Collectible in Verify CGC Certification.

IMO, it should qualify as a card that is overgraded and should be compensated for fair market value

Remedies for Collectibles that are Not Genuine or (in the Case of Trading Cards Only) Are Overgraded. If Guarantor determines, in its sole reasonable opinion, that

1. the Collectible (other than a CGC Signatures Series sketch, print, or photograph) is not genuine;
2. a designated witnessed signature is not genuine; or
3. the correct grade for the CGC-certified trading card is lower than the one assigned on the CGC label;

then Guarantor will offer one of the three remedies described below. The choice of remedy will be made by Guarantor in its sole discretion, and the remedies are subject to the further limitations set forth below. Current Fair Market Value is determined solely by Guarantor as described in each of the listed remedies and the “Fair Market Value” paragraph that follows.

1. For Trading Cards Only: Guarantor shall (a) return the trading card to Owner encapsulated with a label indicating the newly established correct (lower) grade and (b) pay to Owner the difference between the current Fair Market Value of an accurately graded trading card at the original incorrect (higher) grade and the current Fair Market Value of the trading card at the newly established correct (lower) grade.
2. Guarantor may purchase the Collectible from Owner. Guarantor will pay the lesser of
3. the Declared Value of the Collectible as stated by Owner on the submission form for Appearance Review;
4. the Fair Market Value of an accurately graded, genuine Collectible at the original grade; or
5. the amount actually paid for the Collectible by Owner in an actual arm’s length transaction, plus any postage, shipping or other incidental expenses incurred by Owner in submitting the Collectible for Appearance Review service.If Owner was also the original submitter of the Collectible for certification, then the compensation, if any, will not exceed the Declared Value of the Collectible either when originally submitted for certification or when submitted for Appearance Review.
6. Alternatively, Guarantor may retain the submitted Collectible and provide to Owner in its place an equivalent Collectible that is genuine and has the same grade as originally assigned to the submitted Collectible.

I’ll fight them on this. If it was a low value modern card i wouldnt care, but they damaged a beatiful card and should be accountable.

[wjames]

When looking straight on you cant tell that its bent. So it didnt show up on the scan. Probably why the seller didnt catch it and why I didnt either. I bought it a few months ago and didnt even catch it until last week.

https://imgur.com/a/7DC87XH

[stagecoach]

While I genuinely feel for you here, I don’t think you have any recourse. :\

[knotchi]

sell it on pwcc

[xileets]

…or unluckily. =(

It appears the bend does not extend the full length of the contact edge with the case. Agreed, you can’t get this kind of damage once it’s in the case, and I’d say, it must be a mis-grade. Rare, but unlucky.

[zorloth]

I think it’s pretty unlikely that it’s a misgrade. I have a hard time imagining a grader missing that sort of damage, especially given how notoriously harsh on corners CGC is.

Much more likely, I think, is that the card was damaged during encapsulation. There’s zero way that damage could happen after the card left CGC’s hands. The fact that they’re saying this is pretty ridiculous but completely consistent with what I’ve come to expect from third-party grading companies.

OP’s recourse is basically just to resell the item. Personally, I’d disclose this sort of damage. But if OP doesn’t want to, PWCC is a decent option as @knotchi mentioned.

[wjames]

These are my thoughts exactly. I’m not sure how I’ll proceed but I’m for sure going to bug the shit out of CGC regardless. I understand these things happen but grading companies should be held accountable when this happens.

[markzkong]

Any reason why you can’t return via ebay or contact the seller and see if you can work out a deal?

I had an incident like this previously but it was a psa 8 gold star with a corner dent. Spoke to the seller and we came to a deal (I kept the PSA 8 dent gold star but got a discount on my next order).

I don’t agree with what other people are saying and I don’t care if I am in the minority. You shouldn’t pass this on to PWCC knowing full well this card is a misgrade in the current condition. Put yourself in the shoe of the next buyer who purchased this without knowing the damage. He/she will probably feel just as bad as you did when you got this card.

To me that is unethical. If someone stole from you, you shouldn’t get even by stealing from the next innocent party. Work it out with CGC or the seller and ebay or sell as it is but please disclose this damage to your next buyer.

[wjames]

I appreciate the comment but I’d rather this not turn into an ethical efour debate. That wasn’t the point of the post, I was just looking for guidance and experience when dealing with the grading company directly when this happens.