True, but there are cards that genuinely sit between grades. And you are just resubmitting the same card. I just can’t get down with altering. It’s no coincidence it’s happening now and not 5-10 years ago. 
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I am also against altering cards. I just can’t get on board with the idea of getting rid of creases and dents as altering. Because it’s impossible to enforce against it and it’s impossible to define what should and shouldn’t be tolerated. It’s basically just advanced forms of taking your finger and pushing it on your card.
If someone sells me a car where they popped a dent out of a quarter panel I don’t really care if they tell me about it and wouldn’t consider it modified. If they sell me a car and completely replaced the quarter panel, I’d like to know.
In contrast, something like polishing actually does impact the physical quality of the card long term. It can lead to increased micro scratching and holo cracking over time.
*Edit^
Prattes new avatar keeps triggering my childhood adhd lol
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Overall agreed. Tho, as a collectible, and not a car, I think buffing out scratches and dents is more significant.
As for re-grading, you’re trying to alter a subjective value placed on an object by a qualitative analysis, which may be more or less critical than the last; Unlike trying to change something about the actual card. It’s like getting a second opinion.
How many of those people are just wanting an Honest second opinion and how many of those people are just hoping the grader is checked out or overlooks something and over grades their card?
Would you rather have a PSA 9 that had a dent that was removed using the basic laws of physics or a PSA 9 that should not have been graded that high to begin with? There is a good chance you would only ever know about one of those two things regardless. Unless you were shown a before and after pic.
Again I’m only referring to fixing dents and creases. Not polishing/trimming/inking which actually involve removing part of the card or adding to the card.
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Completely off topic, but where else can we discuss his new avatar. I see it and keep thinking of the N64 logo.
Okay, back to the topic at hand!
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That’s what part of the design! I’m glad that people see that and hope it’s well received! I should probably just make it a thread. 
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Simple. All of these cleaning supplies that offer to get your PSA 3 card quality for a PSA 10 is cheating. It’s dumb and not morally right. You’re cosmetically altering your card that isn’t meant to get a makeover. Keep that on your face.
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heh. Point well made.
As a professional I often wonder that too: How many people truly want an honest second opinion, rather than someone to tell them what they want to hear?
I think you and I agree. I’m better with smoothing out a dent, than with getting a 9 on a clear 8.
I wonder:
With the cost of the time to repair, and supplies, wouldn’t it be better to just get a job? haha.
Seriously though. Is it worth it, even?
And then, you’ll have a reputation if anyone finds out that you sell “restored” cards. Not worth it, IMO.
9s and 8s as far as psa goes the difference is pretty subtle. But a 9 and a 6 is very different
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i thought the general consensus was:
If you are using weird chemicals to polish the cards and make the card look more vibrant and the holo more shiny, its not okay. Are you trimming cards? Also not okay.
Are you using a bit of humidity or water to clean off specks of dirt, dust, fingerprint on the card? Are you using a bit of humidity to restore a warped card back to a more flat state? I think this is all okay. I even think using humidity to see if a card becomes less creased is okay. I think trying to press out the wrinkles comes with the inherent risks of damaging the card further, but i think its generally okay too.
“PSA will not grade cards that bear evidence of trimming, re-coloring, restoration, or any other forms of tampering, or are of questionable authenticity.”
The guidelines are pretty vague and nonspecific for the most part, but i think as long as no chemicals are used, and you arent changing or altering the physical and chemical structure and properties of the card, then i dont see an issue with it. If you can somehow make a card look less creased without using any chemicals or whatever, and isnt a short term deceptive fix, what exactly is the issue here?
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Many collectors do not want a “restored” mint card. Think about going to a car dealership. You’re not going to pay the same price for a refurbished car as you would a new car off of the factory line. The problem here is that the buyer is not privy to the alteration, and their assumption is that they are buying a mint card from the pack/factory.
This is far more common in the coin collecting world. Cleaning of coins is common and unwanted, as it removes the patina (oxidization of the metal) and often damages the coin further on a microscopic level. It becomes less clear with trading cards where the buyer may not be able to spot the alterations, but it is still a dishonest practice.
If the alterations were acknowledged and the card was sold Mint (Restored), that would be better.
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PSA is aware of the “cleaning” that’s going on… but doesn’t seem to be too concerned about it or at least don’t view it as “altering” the cards.
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i dont think the car analogy makes much sense in this context, but i sort of see what youre saying, and i think you misunderstood me. By your analogy, buying a psa 10 card is buying a card that is fresh off the factory printing lines that went straight to grading. That’s just not true. You arent paying for a mint card thats pack fresh. I would even argue that majority of PSA 10s are probably not pack fresh. They have probably been sitting in someones collection for quite some time, and often times, many years, before it got sent for grading.
and think about how many PSA 8ss youve seen that probably should have gotten 10s. It doesnt matter what you think. you arent the authenticator. and even if it was a misgrade, well it is what it is. and unless you regrade it, the fact is, no matter how perfect or how mint the card is, if PSA authenticated it as an 8, then its 8. Even if they’re wrong, they’re right. That’s the annoying thing with grading. PSA cant look at the card once its up for auction and retroactively decide “Sorry, our fault, that looks like it should be a PSA 10 grade. Not sure why it got a PSA 8, must be a mistake. Guys, this is PSA 10 card, not a PSA 8. It says PSA 8, but really, it should be a 10.” It will sell as a psa 8. Even if it literally was an ultra mint card that wasnt even packaged, just fresh off the factory press, no human fingers touched the card, went straight to a sleeve and card saver and then sent to PSA fresh. It can still come back as an 8. Maybe even a 7 or 6. I think we’ve seen it all with grades. We’ve seen the opposite happen too. There are so many PSA 10 cards out there that probably should have been a lower grade, but it didnt. It got a 10, and sells as a 10. You are paying for this arbitrary number some company decided to give it. A gem mint card certainly doesnt mean you are buying a card that is fresh out of a pack or factory. It just means you’re buying a card thats in really great condition. If we were to use the car analogy, it would be more like, you have a car sitting in the garage that barely has any miles on it. But its been in the garage and has been collecting dust, but you get a hose and wash the car with a bit of water before presenting it to the buyer. The buyer knows hes getting a used car. The agreement is that the car should be in great condition. Theres no scratch marks on the paint. You didnt give it a paint job. You didnt replace the engines or change anything about the car. All you did was hose it down with some water because maybe some dirt and dust acculmuated on the car over the years. The buyer isnt going to be like, “first of all, how dare you. you washed the dust off this car? you washed off this precious dust that got onto the car over the years? You disgust me, and i refuse to buy this car now. youre not scamming me buddy, i wanted it with the dust and dirt, but now youve ruined the car completely. its not even the same car anymore. Its a totally different now!” spits at the guys feet “you are ruining it for all car enthusiasts.” Because thats the situatioin im trying to portray here.
When you mention oxidation of coins, thats quite literally a chemical change, and thats something I dont think is okay either. Im in total agreement with you on that. I dont think its okay to chemically alter cards.
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I’ve thought about this a lot and often wonder if a service similar to comic book pressing will become mainstream for cards. In my opinion, it is a question of when rather than if this happens. When a company can make money from offering a service, inevitability they will.
I personally feel that some cleaning is acceptable, such as removing specks of dirt with a cotton swab or flattening curved cards. I do however believe that altering a card by polishing holographic surfaces, trimming edges, adding colour to covering damage/whitening, and so on is crossing the line and could be used to mislead potential future buyers that they are getting a better preserved card than they actually are.
I am sure it could be argued that what people do with their own cards is their own business. And that is true however those cards will eventually end up being passed on to others, even if that is many years in the future when the original owner has passed away. Morbid I know but all of our collections will eventually be passed on to others.
Because of this, I personally am against altering cards. It’s just a question of where to draw the line between altering and cleaning for me.
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This popped up on my instagram suggestions. Not sure how I feel about it tbh
Still seems like a misgrade. Psa would have had it be a 5-6 with the original dent and a solid 6 with the dent after pressing it. Also, as far as pressing, ive always heard the rumors of not using screwdown cases because you can overpress the card and ruin the integrity but im pretty sure thats just rumors from bad personal experiences.
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Check this out.
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Thank you!
I have first hand experience with this and have seen it happen. My friend inherited a collection and the 1st ed Base Zard was in one of those thick acrylic screw down cases (albeit for 20+ years).
They were concerned about it (as was I) and they took it out asap.
Heritage was so confident it wouldn’t be a problem that (after having it in hand) they offered to pay for grading and if it was an issue eat the cost (this was in 2021 so it wasn’t cheap).
Out of all the cards in the collection that Charizard was the only one PSA refused to grade. They don’t tell you why but they saw something. Luckily Heritage ate the cost.
There’s actually a picture of that card in the acrylic case in my collection thread if want to see it. #shamelessplug
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