shadowless vs 1st edition pop count

Hi guys quick question, what does everyone think about shadowless being rarer than 1st edition in terms of pop count because if the unlimited pop count contains shadowless cards then the pop count for shadowless is inaccurate leaving me to believe there probably not actually rarer than 1st edition base and have higher pop counts than perceived. so my question is when shadowless had this rise in price towards the end of last year (especially zard) was this because people had a false sense of how many shadowless cards actually exist forcing the market to believe there is actually a lower supply when realistically there is not, which provides the thought *underrated* when really, once prices climbed people realised theres way more available than they thought so caused the price points to be overrated causing them to dip to where they are today.

I understand there may be more people choosing to sell at the time causing prices to dip but the reason why alot of people thought shadowless was so underrated was due to the pops being alot lower than 1st edition so what im thinking is shadowless is probally overrated rather than underrated? with the exceptions of 10 grades

As you already mentioned, unlimited pop count contains shadowless for the first years (maybe someone here can elaborate when they first started to categorize it?) so it´s pretty obvious that its not as rare as 1st, I mean 1st is 1st, right? I don´t think that they are overrated, comparing prices from 1st and shadowless they seem, given the supply that is available on the market, rather underrated than overrated.

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thanks for the quick response!!

i would be intrigued to find out when PSA starting separating shadowless from unlimited, its just a shame the separation wasn’t made from the beginning as it literally looks like a totally different card when comparing to unlimited

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@garyis2000 can elaborate on this for you as he’s the one who got it designated in the first place

The common belief is the base 1st ed and shadowless cards were printed equally at the same time. The 1st ed stamp was applied to half of that 1st print run and the second half of the print run did not get the 1st ed stamp. People used to think the shadowless cards lacking the 1st ed stamp were fake so many people destroyed them or simply tossed them. Also, 1st ed cards were stashed away more back in the day whereas shadowless cards were more used to play with…


Shadowless were first designated in 2008 and yes, there’s some in the Unl pop. Some, but believe me. Not a lot. Like I’ve said numerous times, you could search PSA Pokemon on eBay in the mid 2000s and 20 items would pop up. I know I regraded all of mine just to get them designated shadowless. Most others did the same.


thanks gary for the info



I remember when Gene came into the hobby. He bought a TON of 1st and shadowless cards from me. I’m talking 10s of thousands.
He’s a good guy but doesn’t really have first hand knowledge of their distribution.

Very interesting. Great info here!

Of course sometimes the shadowless pop count ends up with an unlimited card in it…

I would be more interested in the base 2000 pop count. As the cards are not seen as different from unlimited by PSA (yet) and therefore there is less data. I would think the amount of base 2000 holos would be less than 1st edition.