How to start collecting questions

General
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So I’m some what new to the hobby to a sense and am trying to figure how to start out. What I mean by this is I look on this forum and see new people posting amazing PSA 10 collections without any prior buying or selling. I know Pokémon eventually pays for itself since some people live pretty much solely off the selling and the buying and can pay for there whole collections. However, I assume that it wasn’t always that way and at one time you had to spend money before you could start earning it.
I guess my question for the community is when can my collection start paying for itself and where do I start?

Thanks in advance,
Mjisaacs

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Just collect for fun, worrying about profits is the wrong way to go about it imo

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What do you mean when you say when will your collection start paying for itself? Are you asking how do you start buying and selling cards and how long until you get to the point where your initial expenditure is paid off and everything you have at that point is ‘free’?

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Pick a set or goal and stick to it :blush: chose cards you like to, it all falls into place eventually. And take your time :ok_hand:

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Start with a goal and a budget. Keep your starting goals modest and with a budget you can afford. This hobby is a marathon not a sprint. eBay is hands down the best marketplace for Pokemon cards. Here you can browse over a million Pokemon related listings, search for specific items, make offers and bid in auctions. Combine this with eBay’s buyer and seller protections and you have a fairly safe place to buy and sell cards.

My second piece of advice would be to find your niche. Everyone’s collection is different. Some like single species of Pokemon, some like collecting high grades, some like collecting the rarest of the rare, some like collecting just sets. Find what you really like and have fun with it.

In regards to your question about your collection paying for itself, remember this: the rarer, the more mint, the older, the scarcer and the more sought after card is almost always going to carry more value in the future.

Happy collecting!

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There’s some misinformation in your post (not sure if it is intentional or you just did not mention it). So I thought I should clarify some things!

  1. “New” people on this forum does not necessarily mean they had no prior experience. While Efour is great for any kind of collector, the best part of where Efour shines is in very specific and niche questions that no other forum can answer. I stumbled onto Efour because I had some very specific questions where it was difficult to find answers to, and many members graciously helped me out. Prior to joining efour I already had years of experience in collecting cards, and my overall portfolio already at least decupled in size.

  2. Just because they have “PSA 10s” or whatever in their collection, does not mean they are making money or their collection is profitable. They may be taking a “loss” from buying those cards. A collector could have simply overpaid to have those cards in their collection.

  3. I think the community is a minority in regards to how “Pokemon pays for itself”. Remember, members here are collectors at heart. Yes, some people run a Pokemon business and can easily buy and sell to the point where new incoming cards they are purchasing are simply from the profits of their old cards, but I can almost assure you that this is a minority. Members buy cards because they like the card, and want to collect them. Profits are inherently secondary. While our assets/collection grows significantly in value, the most likely scenario is that our assets grow, but we are technically taking a consistent loss because we are simply funneling more money into our collection; we don’t sell off some cards to buy others. This especially makes no sense to high end collectors on this forum because most likely whatever price you sell your card for, if you want the card back in the future, it would cost significantly more to re-purchase it.

Like the other members have said, focus more on the collecting aspect than anything. If you only think of Pokemon cards as raw numbers attached to a value, you’re going to have a bitter time collecting Pokemon cards. Also, if you simply get cards because of their value and not because you like them, you will be significantly more unhappy when you are unable to sell them because you will literally have an expensive asset that you do not even like in the first place.

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Don’t get caught up in trying to keep up with the Joneses.

That isn’t a given. It really only happens if you have the drive and passion for it and given enough time become very knowledgeable in the hobby.

Start by setting a budget and setting goals. Do you wish to build your own collection? Most of the more successful people in the hobby become able to continually make money in it as more of a side effect and not a primary goal. They simply pursue their passion and devote time and money to it only months/years later find that the hobby is self sustaining and self growing if done properly. Again that will only come with knowledge and experience. For now set some reasonable budget and goals and work from there.

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Yeah and that’s definitely the reason I’m doing it. There is a point though where if you don’t have the funds to collect what you want though you kind of have to make money or go broke… but I definitely see your point!

Yeah basically. I understand there is never really a “free” in the hobby since you still have to trade something to earn money, but yeah that’s kind of what I’m asking.

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1.Yeah I see what you mean. I guess to clarify I’ve been collecting since HeartGold and SoulSilver, however am finding a much greater joy in it now and am getting more into it. So I’m new to forums and to the older cards which is where the most beautiful cards are from.
2.You also make a good point here. I guess I assumed that people would have a way to get back there losses from a great card, but as you stated that isn’t always true.
3.Again excellent point. The problem I’m having is the cards that I want to collect because they are so gosh darn beautiful is wizards of the coast stuff. I completely get where you coming from, because for me one of the best parts of the hobby is researching the cards and figuring out there history.

Sorry that it seemed like making money is all I cared about. I promise that isn’t the case. I really do love this hobby and am collecting because I want too. I just want my bank account to not go into the negative while enjoying the hobby as well. Hope that clears up the confusion.

@gottaketchumall
Thanks for the advice! I definitely have the passion for the hobby. At least the researching side of things since I’m always looking to find new cards to learn about and new discoveries.

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@mjisaacs

No need to apologize, there’s nothing wrong about making money; you’re just going to have a bad time doing so if this is your sole focus from collecting Pokemon cards. You’re not the first nor the last to ask this question, similar new members asked this before:http://efour.proboards.com/thread/10705/general-advice-beginner-essay

It’s definitely doable to have your card collecting go through a self-sustaining cycle, but you’re going have to put a ton more effort into collecting as a hobby, and the turnaround time is typically much longer. Think about it in your situation; you like WOTC cards so your main collection is going to be WOTC. How are you going to make profit out of it? The only possibility of making profit while maintaining your collection is to buy multiples of cards you own, otherwise you technically have to part away with cards you want to keep. Therefore, you’re going to have more cards than needed in your collection, and for a decently long term you will have even less money than before. This is just one example of trying to make a profit, but other members have many other different ways but this is technically how I used to do it. Alternatively you can buy cards that you can part with since you don’t really like them, speculating those cards will increase in price in the future. This is something I notice a handful of members of E4 would do, but then a chunk of your collection is stuck with dozens of cards that you don’t really like.

If you really like your cards, you will also face a dilemma when trying to sell cards that you actually want to keep for a profit. You would make a pretty buck selling off a PSA 10 1st base charizard if you own one years ago, but despite all this profit, you know for a fact you probably won’t be able to buy one in the future for the same price as before, so there will be a gap in your collection that would require even more money to refill…that is unless you had 2 copies of the same card.

In my situation, selling less than 1% of my collection can definitely cover the remaining 99% of the cost of all my cards, but knowing that I can never get that 1% back, I would never do it, hence why I’ll always be at a loss.

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I’ll answer the question the way you wanted it answered. Gotta hit it pretty much on the head, you’re going to need a huge knowledge base. When I first started I only wanted the original cards I collected from childhood. I kept going when I saw more and more cards. That experience being on the buying end gave me a sense for what I should expect cards prices to go for.

Eventually, I got into psa grading (I started back in a time when psa grading wasn’t the norm). This used to be the best way to make money as there was a bunch of mint cards ungraded and a large group of people that didn’t self grade. Over time this option got harder and it’s almost to the point where it’s too difficult, as PSA graded cards are starting to get closer to raw cards prices.

I also learned about using yahoo japan, this was another great avenue to getting cards cheaper and reselling them where they earned more. Again this became me more difficult as more people started doing this and closing the gap on the price differences.

Now a majority of my profit comes from seeking out underpriced deals, and investments of duplicate cards.

Tl;dr, getting a bunch of knowledge, and adapting to the ever changing landscape is the only way to make a profit in this hobby. Honestly, most of the time I reinvest my liquid assets into the stock market unless a better deal through Pokémon comes along. I think a better title for myself is a day trader rather than a card salesman.

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Just keep in mind that if you have one Ponyta, your collection is much nicer than PresidentTrumps or Bill Gates,

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I have 3 Ponytas so I must be doing something right! :blush:

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If these people are new to the hobby and they’re not flippers†, then they’re using their hard earned money from their day job.

A bit of selection bias here - just because you see big boys like smpratte, gary, and cullers buying and selling $25k+ items with a collection behind them worth 6-7 figures doesn’t mean Pokemon always pays for itself. These are the top flippers, ahem, dealers in the hobby, and the time and cash they’ve poured into the hobby for the past 10-20-30 years isn’t something that you’re privy to. They didn’t just arrive at the top, they’ve been working their ass off since they started.

The average user on this forum is not cash positive from this hobby. Meaning, if you calculate Cashsales - Cashpurchases, the vast majority of users here will have a negative result. Now, it’s very possible that the market value of their collection compared to the amount they’ve spent far exceeds what they paid for the cards, but what I’m trying to get at is that the collection only ‘pays for itself’ when you’ve made more from selling cards than you’ve spent purchasing cards. And for 90+% (I’d wager) of collectors here, that just isn’t the case.

Even when you want to start getting into the flipping side of things, you’re going to have to spend money to make money. Buy low, sell high. You can’t sell before you buy.

In effect, your question is, how do I successfully buy and sell Pokemon cards so that I’ll be able to make enough money to pay for the cards that I want to collect? And unfortunately, the first rule of that all flippers must adhere to in order to survive and profit is that you never talk in detail about your flipping strategies. Not where to buy, not how to buy, not when to buy, nada. Nothing personnel, kid. Remember the amount of time I mentioned that smpratte et al had to go through in order to get to where they are? This is part of that. The information’s out there. The flipping opportunities are out there. But you won’t find them (or, honestly, even get remotely close to them) without putting in hundreds and thousands of hours of initial research and then an ungodly amount of ongoing effort to actually find and be available to the opportunities when they arrive.

† - Flipper, card dealer - same thing. Someone that sells something for more than they bought it for, on a routine basis and as a way to make money, is a flipper.

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First card I purchased since my childhood, was a PSA 9 Zapdos Shadowless First Edition in 2014. It was my favorite card as a kid and I wanted to own a mint copy as an adult. I did not really start collection until recently. I researched, followed many of SMPRATTES youtube vids and decided to collect some Mint First Edition Shadowless and some rare Japanese Promos. To me it was not only the next best thing to your illustrator or Trophy Cards, but just really neat cards to collect that are no doubt very valuable and sought after. Up to you where you want to start. I am not a set collector and I am not into new stuff, unless it is new japanese exclusives. So many ways to go about it. Good luck!

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This is a bit of an oversimplification. A flipper is someone who buys product and immediatly sells it. With me, Gary, and Smpratte (your examples) we’ve sat on product for years at a time. I think it’d be more accurate to call us investors. Think of it like the stock market, if you’re trying to predict the peaks and valleys you’re not going to do very well (flipper); however, if you invest and not worry about it for 5 years (min experts recommend) you’ll find you’ve made money almost every time.

With pokemon in order to flip you’d need to buy at roughly 50% of the market value (guesstimation), just to be able to support yourself, or extreemly high volume at a higher percentage. You can see how this isn’t sustainable. The other option is to sell for nearly double market value, you won’t find too many buyers: aka not sustainable either.

Honestly, I don’t see flipper as a title that big of a deal. When the 50% below market value deals pop up I’ll flip it, as I think just about anyone would; however, giving the people you mentioned that title compared to a full time flipper is a bit of a streach. Flippers don’t last in this hobby, we’ve been around for years.

This is purely semantics, but I think in the context of this discussion it’s important that we clarify this a bit, as well as give some info.

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If you’re asking what the safe bet is for at least being able to sell your cards for what you paid for them, and without waiting a super long time, I’d recommend base set shadowless. Base set is just the safest collection in the hobby and the most nostalgic/well known and shadowless is ridiculously affordable unlike it’s 1st edition counterpart- plus it has the added value of a single print release. It’s a fun set to start out with without breaking the bank. That’s what I’d recommend and yes, it’s just an opinion/educated speculation. I know you don’t want to hear the canned answer “just collect for fun”, so hopefully this gives you something to look into. Also, charizards are never a bad investment, if you like charizard. Just think about what EVERYONE has heard of instead of just niche collectors. But again, I’ll echo everyone else, collect what you like. There are easier ways to pay for your hobby than trying to buy and sell pokemon cards.

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I actually like the “just collecting for fun.” It’s the easiest and simplest answer out there. My main collection before getting into Pokémon was skylanders. What I’ve learned about myself is the best part about collecting is the research that everyone keeps mentioning. I absolutely love learning and growing my knowledge on different cards and different variants of the same card.
Thank you for the advice on Shadowless Cards as well! :blush:

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Happy collecting! Welcome back to the hobby