Why is Japanese pull rates so much better than English?

[azulryu]

@ldubbs

@azulryu

When I say I have “ethical issues”, please note that I don’t believe these are high on the hierarchy of ethical concerns. This is more on the scale of being more ethical than taking two smarties from your friend’s candy wrapper when they said you could only have one.

Someone inform me if I’m wrong, but Japan set the standard for rarity with their product in terms of holos and non-holos (aka, rares are holo and there’s a holo rare in every pack). English sets did not meet that standard - nevermind maintaining the standard for even card quality. I should have stated “led to other ethical concerns”. I’ll agree that the English prints probably didn’t intend for the issue of weighed cards, but trying to get more profit for less product (getting a non-holo but still saying it’s “rare” is drivel), is pretty scummy. We have issue with “Random lots with CHANCE of Ultra Rare” listings on ebay for the same reason - it drives a synthetic market that gives no guarantee unless you can afford boxes instead of packs.

If I buy a hot dog, for example, I shouldn’t have to buy two for a CHANCE of getting mustard.

Long story short. I just think it’s bullshit that English packs don’t guarantee a holo rare nor hold up to the same standard of card quality as Japan. It’s why we see inflated card prices for English sets just because of “condition” when, in all seriousness, there are Japanese cards out in the world that are actually more RARE in quantity that are monetarily worth less.

Increase card quality, make holo rares the norm in English packs = more accessibility for more collectors. Chase cards exist purely in this state because you might not get the RARE you wanted. Win/Win.

…

Well, unless you’re a flipper.

So a few problems with your statements. You cannot compare “Random lots with CHANCE of Ultra Rare” listings to selling factory sealed packs by a large corporation. A seller on ebay directly benefits from manipulating what cards are given to the buyer because they sell each card on the secondary market and maintain a higher profit margin by giving you worse cards, that is why those listings are shady and scummy. The Pokemon company doesnt benefit more when they sell a pack with a holo charizard or a holo muk or no holo inside because they are getting the same payment on the pack regardless of what the buyer pulls.

The hot dog comparison makes no sense. Everyone buying pokemon packs is looking for SOME level of risk, some are riskier than others. Nobody goes to buy a pokemon card pack knowing EXACTLY what is inside, but everyone buying food, in this case a hot dog, expects to know exactly what food they are buying and what is in or on the food.

There’s nothing wrong with English packs not guaranteeing a holo, as you can see by the market they have been very successful in doing so. This has been the pattern of success in many other TCGs as well like Yugioh, Magic (I believe), and even sports many times do not guarantee an autograph or a “Holo Rare” (Holo Rare’s in sports are obviously different just using pokemon lingo). The point is everyone has accepted these risks and continue to buy them. There’s nothing wrong with doing it this way just because it is not your preference.

This is my argument: If a standard was made to ensure that one rare equated with one holo, then every other line should follow that model. English prints did not (I can’t speak for other prints). Why? To make even more of a profit when it wasn’t necessary.

The company is benefiting more. It takes more product to provide a holo than it does to provide a non-holo. They had the option to follow Japanese standards. They did not. Why? To make more money.

The risk is in whether or not you get the cards you want. That’s all. Adding a secondary level of risk by making some of the cards you want as a non-holo variant is shitty. They had the option to follow Japanese standards. They did not. Why? To make more money.

You said there’s nothing wrong with English packs not guaranteeing a holo. Why? Because you justify that it made the market more successful. Which is my whole point.

My problem is that the company made more loop holes in providing non-holos for the sake of making a larger profit. I have the same issue with Yugioh as well. Not so much with MTG since that didn’t start in Japan. Yes, we accepted it as the norm. Doesn’t mean there’s not a problem with it.

I’m just glad they didn’t make it so that you could have a random holo so that you now wanted to collect every holo variant oh wait.

Unpopular opinion time: Pokemon collecting is for suckers. We collect pretty pictures of expensive cardboard. We are all suckers for that reason.

Just because you enjoy something doesn’t mean that there aren’t problems with it. Just because you’re involved in something doesn’t mean you can’t criticize it either.

And on that note: I love collecting. Don’t let my thoughts make it seem like you shouldn’t. I love all of my little pieces of cardboard and even bought a high quality binder to show other people my pretty pictures. I still enjoy opening new packs. Do I prefer opening Japanese packs? Absolutely. Does that stop me from enjoying opening English packs? Absolutely not. I still throw my money at the Pokemon Leviathan for a reason.

[kurtosisblakeinfini]

@ldubbs

@kurtosisblakeinfini

Mind you have any standalone highest point set rarity cards have ever been viable for double demand? Crystalshiningstars? Legends at a push?

?

In game viablility so a chase for an extra saucy reason.

[ldubbs]

@azulryu

@ldubbs

So a few problems with your statements. You cannot compare “Random lots with CHANCE of Ultra Rare” listings to selling factory sealed packs by a large corporation. A seller on ebay directly benefits from manipulating what cards are given to the buyer because they sell each card on the secondary market and maintain a higher profit margin by giving you worse cards, that is why those listings are shady and scummy. The Pokemon company doesnt benefit more when they sell a pack with a holo charizard or a holo muk or no holo inside because they are getting the same payment on the pack regardless of what the buyer pulls.

The hot dog comparison makes no sense. Everyone buying pokemon packs is looking for SOME level of risk, some are riskier than others. Nobody goes to buy a pokemon card pack knowing EXACTLY what is inside, but everyone buying food, in this case a hot dog, expects to know exactly what food they are buying and what is in or on the food.

There’s nothing wrong with English packs not guaranteeing a holo, as you can see by the market they have been very successful in doing so. This has been the pattern of success in many other TCGs as well like Yugioh, Magic (I believe), and even sports many times do not guarantee an autograph or a “Holo Rare” (Holo Rare’s in sports are obviously different just using pokemon lingo). The point is everyone has accepted these risks and continue to buy them. There’s nothing wrong with doing it this way just because it is not your preference.

This is my argument: If a standard was made to ensure that one rare equated with one holo, then every other line should follow that model. English prints did not (I can’t speak for other prints). Why? To make even more of a profit when it wasn’t necessary.

The company is benefiting more. It takes more product to provide a holo than it does to provide a non-holo. They had the option to follow Japanese standards. They did not. Why? To make more money.

The risk is in whether or not you get the cards you want. That’s all. Adding a secondary level of risk by making some of the cards you want as a non-holo variant is shitty. They had the option to follow Japanese standards. They did not. Why? To make more money.

You said there’s nothing wrong with English packs not guaranteeing a holo. Why? Because you justify that it made the market more successful. Which is my whole point.

My problem is that the company made more loop holes in providing non-holos for the sake of making a larger profit. I have the same issue with Yugioh as well. Not so much with MTG since that didn’t start in Japan. Yes, we accepted it as the norm. Doesn’t mean there’s not a problem with it.

I’m just glad they didn’t make it so that you could have a random holo so that you now wanted to collect every holo variant oh wait.

Unpopular opinion time: Pokemon collecting is for suckers. We collect pretty pictures of expensive cardboard. We are all suckers for that reason.

Just because you enjoy something doesn’t mean that there aren’t problems with it. Just because you’re involved in something doesn’t mean you can’t criticize it either.

And on that note: I love collecting. Don’t let my thoughts make it seem like you shouldn’t. I love all of my little pieces of cardboard and even bought a high quality binder to show other people my pretty pictures. I still enjoy opening new packs. Do I prefer opening Japanese packs? Absolutely. Does that stop me from enjoying opening English packs? Absolutely not. I still throw my money at the Pokemon Leviathan for a reason.

It’s almost like a for profit company is trying to make money or something.

[azulryu]

@ldubbs

It’s almost like a for profit company is trying to make money or something.

Yes, while diluting the quantity and quality of the original design.

[muk]

I have to agree with @azulryu here, at least for sets like Jungle, Fossil & TR, where WOTC just made the Holos non-Holo Rares.
“But it was for the players to have easier access to those cards” → there wouldn’t be a need for that move if they’d put a Holo in every pack.

If you give me non-Holo, I’d at least want some decent unique artwork. Otherwise it really feels like a forced money-grab.

[mcorey777]

@azulryu

@ldubbs

It’s almost like a for profit company is trying to make money or something.

Yes, while diluting the quantity and quality of the original design.

Right they couldn’t even afford to buy a few new printers to avoid print lines?