Ive been following alot of the posts here for a while now, but Im very curious if CGC will actually make a statement. If nothing is done, and time goes on are the main people responsible going to continue to make blank statements, or none at all. As time goes on this gives them additional time to think of loopholes. Has anyone who spent alot of money on these asked a lawyers opinion. Its still a very vulnerable state to be in, but we’re all hoping for the best.
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We just got an info from Fanatics employee on our little chat on Instagram that Fanatics will not pay any refund. When I asked about BP, this guy vanished so… now you know where not to buy or sell your cards.
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I’ve also got responses from Alt and Fanatics. Neither will be refunding themselves, just facilitating sending the cards to CGC. Pretty disappointing.
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From HA.
Due to recent concerns regarding the authenticity of CGC-graded Pokémon Prototype and Playtest cards, we ask you to submit the following cards directly to CGC. We have been working closely with CGC, and they’ve given us the following statement: CGC stands behind its cards with its guarantee, and every claim will be handled according to the CGC Guarantee .
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Just got the same email even after being told on the phone i would be refunded from HA directly. Pretty lame. What a bummer. I suppose all I can do now is wait a bit to see what happens.
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Fanatics refunds buyers…then Fanatics goes to CGC for reimbursement of lost auctions premiums. Seems like the route I would think it would go?
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It certainly seems sketchy that auctions houses and consignors can profit off of these counterfeits by just pushing the blame to CGC. I’m out a small amount compared to many but what’s most frustrating is Alt had possession of my card and waited to ship it to me several days after these allegations surfaced. Aren’t you not legally allowed to knowingly and willingly distribute counterfeit items? At the very least, the possibility at the time should have made them hold the items until more info came to light (i.e. working with CGC on behalf of their buyers).
Isn’t it better for everyone if the auction houses use their collective power to force CGC’s hand on behalf of their customers rather than leaving everyone to fend for themselves?
I’m pursuing a charge back because I used a credit card for the purchase. The bank is asking for an “expert” second opinion with their “letterhead” stating the item is counterfeit so if anyone wants to lend a hand, let me know 
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All of the major auction houses and Alt are requiring CGC to make the situation whole. The auctions houses are just facilitating the process.
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Hey these ARE the real prototypes though right? Like genuinely this is how they looked like and these are just fake prints? I read through this thread and this wasnt very clear ;-;
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Only Alpha playtest and Coro Coro were documented. The rest could be 100% invented.
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Best thing that coulda happened for rare candy haha
I def won’t be using alt again, and will try to use pwcc only for something that’s not available anywhere else .
I don’t think they are responsible, but I don’t like the taste in my mouth with how they have handled transparency in their response. That’s on top of alts horrible actual auction house system, where I won a card for 1.8k and it immediately went into my vault with a made up value of 11k thing to collect a large % for me to withdraw
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Dunno if it’s been reported yet, but Heritage is also not doing refunds and asking buyers to go direct to CGC
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They used this analysis in the Netflix show “The Night Agent” too. Pretty wild to see it crossover into a real world example!
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Technically, the auction houses aren’t doing anything wrong. Per most of their agreements - they do not take any responsibility for the authentication of any card that has been graded by an authentication company and do outline if there is a question of authenticity, to deal with said grading company instead. They make their fee from selling the item on their platform, which is what they did, so nothing wrong with that. They did not knowingly sell counterfeit cards and also CGC has not officially released a statement stating that the cards are counterfeit, only that there is information available that questions the authenticity.
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They may not have knowingly listed the cards for sale as counterfeits but because this info dropped on a Sunday, there are many cards that the auction houses had possession of despite knowing this information and still accepted payment for and shipped.
Of course auction houses cannot be responsible for sales made weeks or months ago, unless they were complicit in the fraud. I’m primarily concerned with how they are handling the items that ended on the day this came to light.
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Yes, this information has been available on E4 and I have no doubt PFM’s findings are correct. BUT, it has to officially come from CGC. The auction houses are not going to base their decisions on findings on E4. CGC has to officially state and specifically outline (by cert etc.) which cards are counterfeit, otherwise the auction houses will default to CGC’s guarantee (slabs). Two very different things.
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I think there is a difference between “technically not doing anything wrong” and good customer service.
ZandG and Rare Candy had no problem refunding people out of their own pockets and dealing with CGC themselves. That’s good customer service, because it inspires confidence in the platform as well as the items. Effectively, ZandG and Rare Candy have put their money where their mouth is to say that all items sold by them are authentic. That makes me want to buy things from them in the future.
Major auction houses with more money that are passing the buck to CGC in this regard are just going to end up screwing their customers. Not only would they have much more resources and leverage over CGC than individual submitters, but refunding people would establish a level of consumer confidence in their platform, that they stand behind the authenticity of their items. Auction houses also might have recourse to go after the original sellers and expose their practices, but again, they’re passing the buck to CGC.
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I agree with all of that 100% but if there’s reasonable suspicion that some or all of the items are counterfeit wouldn’t holding the items, pausing payments, and/or refunding buyers until there is official confirmation be a prudent action to take?
This isn’t an isolated single/few card instance like typically is the case. This was a bombshell affecting huge swaths of the auction blocks that ended the day of the report. To not say anything and then try to get the items out the door shows a lack of integrity. At the end of the day, they only have a business because of their buyers. To not make even the slightest effort to protect and defend them says a lot.
The beauty of this situation is it makes it much clearer to see who cares about their customers and the hobby as a whole vs who only cares about $$$.
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I’m not sure about Rare Candy as I have never purchased anything from their site, but with ZandG - he only sells TCG, mainly Pokemon. He is also a true member of this community and actively engages with them (Youtube, Social Media). He has a much more vested interest in keeping his customer base happy and for all to see. Heritage and Goldin are major auction houses that offer a plethora of other collectibles, memorabilia, art work, etc. Pokemon TCG is just a small fraction of what they cater to. They are not as engaged with the community either (not like ZandG). They do from time to time showcase very rare collectibles on their social media, but it’s definitely just business for them. I agree, it would be a benefit to them to refund and answer the call from the customers that purchased these cards, but again - the customers that purchased these card only make up small fraction of the total pool of customers - the rest are unaffected. For them, they will just chop this up to the cost of doing business. ZandG and Rare did not have to refund the customers that bought these, in fact, from a business perspective - if they can’t recover the money from CGC, it can be extremely detrimental for the well being of their business (my speculation), but much love and respect for them doing so anyways. Again, the auction houses are just doing what they are supposed to do. CGC needs to answer for this.
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