1st Edition Base Set - 10,000 of each card printed?!

[jabby]

There’s no way to know any of these things with absolute certainty, but I’m definitely in the camp of it being fairly probable that it was literally sold out compared to later releases. The Pokemania back then really was the “wild west” so to speak, the demand was crazy. That’s one of the best articles I found in my research on this over the years since it seemed to come from WOTC themselves. They also specifically mention the “4th print run”, and so how much could honestly have been printed up to that point prior to that? How large each print run was is also unknown, so we can only guess for now on these accounts.

So overall my attitude towards this is there’s most likely a lot less 1st Ed Base in English than all other early 1st Ed WOTC releases simply due to the low projected sales by WOTC themselves and the limited range of distribution compared to later releases.

[kamon]

Idk if we should look at it this way, but if you take the “400k packs sold in the first 6 weeks” comment in the article I posted as the truth and you apply a holo pull rate of 1/3, you get 133k holos in total. Spread across 16 gives you 8.3k per holo.

[acebren]

Yep, it’s the best estimate we have, and it seems close to reality IMO.

[Dyl]

@kamon

Here’s an article suggesting 400k packs were sold in the first 6 weeks. It doesn’t mention anything about those being 1st or unlimited, but I’d guess 1st edition didn’t last longer than a month at most.

When Pokémon And Magic Cards Went To War

What is unknown is whether this number is just including booster boxes (sold through LGS) or whether it is also including retail distribution through big box stores.

1st Ed Base likely had multiple (small) print runs, as can be seen by the availability of booster boxes but also blister packs. The print run of blister packs may be different from the original print run as they require new packaging and distribution elements from a logistics/manufacturing perspective.

[shadowless]

doubtful about a printrun of even close to 100k for holos. it´s all baseless assumptions anyways, but i´m asking myself where all these zards should be, even if 80% of them got destroyed back in the day.

[smpratte]

Just echoing what @acebren mentioned. Wotc employees commented that 1st Ed base had only 1 run and it was shared with shadowless. 100k per holo honestly doesn’t feel right. Gary drove to different states just to buy boxes of 1st Ed base. It was mainly available in the East/west coast of the US. I never saw a single 1sf Ed base product or card in the Midwest.

[Dyl]

@smpratte

Wotc employees commented that 1st Ed base had only 1 run and it was shared with shadowless.

I don’t think that this is possible as there are two stamp thicknesses (i.e., thick vs. thin). It would make no sense to recreate a stamp design mid-way into the original print run while the machines are running. In my head, one type of stamp would have to be from a second print run.

What do you think? This is all just fun speculation after all.

[smpratte]

Thick/thin is just a difference in ink/pressure. It’s not an indicator of different print runs. Similar to the numerous error cards in base set.

[quibble]

I’m wondering whether it was a case of two different machines/factories pushing out that single run? Or there’s always the chance that the actual stamps never changed, just the way they applied to the card as they were worn in - this would explain how some 1st edition Base seem to have a midway thick/thin stamp.

This is an interesting topic regardless. It’s amazing that we’re still just speculating after all these years.

[Dyl]

@smpratte

The stamp difference is just a difference in ink/pressure.

Is this something that is known or is it speculation? They sure do look like different designs to me.

I have always assumed that the thick stamp was the first print run and the thin stamp was the second print run, as this thinner look is what was applied to the later releases of Jungle and Fossil.

@quibble

I’m wondering whether it was a case of two different machines/factories pushing out that single run? Or there’s always the chance that the actual stamps never changed, just the way they applied to the card as they were worn in - this would explain how some 1st edition Base seem to have a midway thick/thin stamp.

It’s definitely possible, but if the print run was as small as others are suggesting, I doubt that they would have dedicated multiple facilities to it given that MTG sets and other products were being released concurrently.

I really wish we had a more definitive answer on these questions.

[smpratte]

It’s 100% the same stamp with different pressure. This conversation has happened multiple times in the past. To the point where people bought a stamp to test the theory and it’s just a difference in pressure. More pressure = thin, less pressure = thick.

Also keep in mind “thick/thin” are collector distinctions. They were never designated by wotc.

[traineramy]

I was lucky to get one pack here in NY when I was a kid. Literally one. Pulled impostor oak and promptly traded him for some pogs

[amcgl58]

That’s poggers…

[Dyl]

Thanks for the explanation. Forgive me for the questions, they aren’t directed toward you but to anyone of course.

@smpratte

It’s 100% the same stamp with different pressure

Is that really how stamps are applied? These 1st Edition marks aren’t “stamped” like a prerelease promo. They receive the “stamp” in the same way that other black ink on the card is printed.

If this was an issue with ink/pressure, how would we get cards like the thin gray stamp? Clearly there is not enough ink to produce the desired stamp saturation, but it still retains the “thin” appearance. Would this suggest that the thin stamp is from pressure alone and not ink per say?

We also know that all non-holos were given the “thick stamp.” However, the thin stamp was exclusive to non-English releases in the same year (1999) and future sets (e.g., Jungle, Fossil).

Is it believed that the 1st Ed Stamp was changed after the English release but before the International releases and English Jungle/Fossil 1st Ed?

[Charizard1020]

So 1st ed only had one run. Shadowless was part of that run. So they each only had one run that was shared.

So everything after that was unlimited? That makes sense. If only I wasn’t 6 at the time I could’ve taken better notes

[smpratte]

Pressure is really the difference, because you can make a thin grey stamp with the same pressure but less ink.

[traineramy]

Oh yeah. I regretted it even as a child lol bought the imposter oak PSA 9 the second I got back in the hobby for I think $50 but it might have been $30 lol

[smpratte]

Here is a quote from a WOTC employee stating the stamps were not changed:

“As to you trying to figure out about the 1st edition stamp being revised, the answer is no. To the best of my knowledge, the 1st edition stamp wasn’t changed.”

Also here was the ancient photo from 11 years ago I dug up showing the same hand stamp creating both thick & thin:

[Dyl]

That is awesome, thanks for sharing this! I remember reading different interviews with WoTC employees over the years but I must have glossed that over.

I wanted to add some known timelines from the old WoTC website. These are timestamps, so the dates reported only tell us about what was going on at that moment and not the months in between.

January 09, 1999:
Base 1st Edition Release (U.S.)

January 25, 1999:
Preconstructed Theme Decks and 2-Player Starter Set are Advertised on WoTC Website

February 08, 1999:
Base 1st Edition Packs are Advertised on WoTC Website (“Edition 1”)

August 30, 1999:
WoTC website is no longer selling 1st Edition packs. WoTC is limiting 400 packs per day. Maybe this is the shadowless release?

October 01, 1999:
WoTC website advertises Fossil (1,200 packs/day) and Jungle (800 packs/day). Fossil is sold out but Base and Jungle are still in stock.

October 13, 1999:
WoTC sells out of Base (400 packs/day), Jungle (800 packs/day), and Fossil (1,200 packs/day).

Orders cannot be made for 1st Edition.

February 07, 2000:
WoTC website mentions selling “longpacks” and reduces the supply to 80 packs per day.

February 08, 2000:
Base Set and Fossil back in stock. Limits of 80 packs per day.

February 29, 2000:
Base Set 2 and Preconstructed Decks are advertised. Limits of 80 packs per day.

[bk2021]

Wow are those from the Wayback Machine?

Data is so easily lost.