Sure, but art as nostalgia is a super specific hole to put it in. “Do you like the art on trophy cards more?” is a hugely different question than, “Do you buy trophy cards primarily because you are nostalgic for the era their art comes from?”
I agree that wholesale discrediting trophy cards as inherently incapable of generating sentimentality is ludicrous. And shoehorning everyone who buys trophy cards as somehow less genuine of a collector is #notliketheothergirls to the extreme.
But the element of nostalgia that specifically longs for our own experiences in the past seems more loosely associated with trophy cards than with early English sets. I don’t see an explanation for the value of trophy cards that isn’t more complex than “Damn, I had a Charizard just like that!”
By your logic, no one would want something if it didn’t exist and they knew about it in their childhood. Anyone that buys an expensive car would only want one made 20+ years ago. Any jewelry they buy better be from the window of a shop from their childhood. Nostalgia is simply 1 factor, just like rarity and I don’t know why you automatically dismiss rarity so easily. Nostalgia is simply a bigger driving force than all other factors for you but the great thing about collecting is you can collect whatever you want. Trophy cards are rare, significant in the hobby, and very eye catching imo.
I can appreciate the art style of the old trophy cards, rarity, and how difficult it can be to acquire them but I don’t have a strong desire to own them. I would prefer to collect the cards I remember obtaining as a kid (Base, Jungle, Fossil, etc.) I’ve pretty much achieved that goal and don’t find myself reaching for trophy cards now.
With more and more collectors coming into the hobby, first they start out on set cards, most will stick here, some will take a deeper interest into trophy cards. I believe with all the new collectors this year we will see a delayed further increase in interest trophy cards.
It takes time to develop and learn knowledge that is the barrier. Been here for a year now and still learning.
I think this is fair, certainly for the vast majority of people. But with the influx of investors that are coming from other hobbies now, there is an increasing number which maybe don’t value nostalgia at all. That is to say, trophies may well be the entry point for them.
If it was purely about chasing nostalgia, people would collect played base set unlimited Charizards because that’s what most people owned and treasured as a child. Almost everyone didn’t have an Illustrator growing up, but they also didn’t have a mint 1st edition Charizard.
I think people just like to own rare things that nobody else can have, I don’t see anything wrong with that. After you’ve had your fill of nostalgia, which a lot of trophy collectors have, considering the most common path to trophy collecting that I’ve seen starts with buying what you had when you were younger, the next step is to collect things from the same era that you didn’t have as a kid. When I was younger I would always have a stronger reaction to things I hadn’t seen before in pokemon, and would often trade my more desired cards (holos) for things I thought were more unique and a perfect example of this would be my trade of my holo machamp for an evolution box error wartortle, purely because I hadn’t seen it before and I thought it was rare. At the time that trade was horrible, but now I’d gladly make that trade again.
I think the same sentiment applies to trophy collectors today, Especially when set cards can always be re-acquired (albeit at a higher cost/lower grade). There is something very enticing and compelling about a card that many want but a very select few can realistically have. This is the same across all collectable hobbies I know of, rarity is more exciting and appealing than something that everybody else can have too.
Just my thoughts and I hope you’re able to understand my point.
I think the nostalgia discussion is semantics. For example, I didn’t grow up with this literal 1997 carddass card. But it is 11/10 nostalgia. That was the point of the smooth brain joke.
Also I did grow up with japanese promos in magazines: birthday pikachu, ana, masaki, cd promos, etc. Some members even grew up with magazines that included the illustrator, trophies, promos, etc. More specifically, I grew up with that art. That pallet is my nostalgia, and what I chase. Its no different than buying a charizard.
I think Charlie’s initial response above is 10/10.
And to elaborate, and in response to the quoted sentence:
There are many collectors who collect based on enjoying the card art. Some of the trophies have some of the best art ever printed. If you’re drawn to older cards from the 1st and 2nd gen, tell me that the original Pikachu Trophies or the Trophy Khan aren’t some of the most beautiful cards ever made.
While the rarity of the trophy cards is a big part of their appeal, it ends up being the intersection of multiple factors that determines their value: rarity, exclusivity of the card, quality of art, exclusivity of the art, nostalgia, historical significance, and the stories / mythical nature of some of the cards (not an exhaustive list). Every collector will individually weigh those factors in their own mind when assessing a collectible, and come up with their own value judgment. But the trophies tick a lot of boxes (some of them tick every box, at the highest caliber within each category).
Then comes the nostalgia of the thrill of the chase itself. Having been in the hobby a long time, I’m nostalgic for multiple prior periods where I collected and chased rare cards. Everytime I see images those cards (even if I never owned them, but just chased them), the same nostalgia kicks in that brought me to the hobby in the first place. I’m more nostalgic for the periods when I was collecting, versus my childhood experience with Pokemon. This only makes me want the rare cards even more.
Edit: also, I don’t think either collectible (trophies or base set) are superior or better for people to collect. I love (and have) both, personally. As others have stated, the beautiful thing about this hobby is that there’s something for everyone .
I have no recollection of ever owning Pokemon cards as a kid, so I have no nostalgia to go off of. Does that mean I can’t have the desire to collect them today? I get it, Base Set is literally the basis of the hobby and I can’t argue the excitement I had when I got my 1st Ed. Charizard.
And you’re right, there is no automatic desirability for trophy cards. But I think once you learn that trophy cards aren’t just rare, and truly understanding the history of the cards, they become very desirable. Who wouldn’t want to own a piece of history of the hobby that, as us collectors, spend so many time, money, etc., into? I know I do, but unfortunately, I don’t have all the monies in the world
Eh, I can see the appeal of Trophies and if they weren’t above my collecting goals, I might chase one or two. As they are right now, though, I don’t have any real desirability in collecting them. We’ll see if that changes in the future.
I think at the end of the day, people collect what they like. I definitely remember the early 2000’s and 90’s Trophy cards as I loved the look of them in old magazines but figured I’d never get my hand on them so I waved them off before I could make a strong connection with them. With Base, at least, I grew up with them and were able to get them very early on as they made my childhood.
I don’t have strong feelings about it either way. No one should poopoo the other. I mostly dislike it when people try to box a certain part of the hobby and tote it around as being “superior” but thankfully those are few and far in between in this case.
If you can recognize charizord as the top card in base set, it’s not hard to translate that to the hobby at large.
There is nothing inherent about base charizord that makes it more special than any other base holo. It would be strange to argue the card is somehow more nostalgic than any other card, especially since the value hiarcherchy that has placed charizord on the top has existed since these cards were released.
To borrow a term, the reason why the most expensive cards are what they are is because of our smooth brain sheep mentality. Desire breeds desire. Nostalgia is the most overplayed card in the deck. Yes it acts as a catalyst to bring people back but there’s a reason why I and many other 90s boomer kids used to have pogs, crazybones, digimon cards, tamagotchi etc etc yet we are only here collecting pokemon cards. Specifically its because we know many others are also actively buying and collecting the same things we are. There’s a psychological satisfaction of owning the charizord that everyone wants and recognizes as valuable whether it be the base unlimited copy on the playground or a psa 10 1st ed copy today.
Trophy cards act the same way. What makes them desirable is that other people desire them. Value is a proxy for this. This is why people Google “most valuable pokemon cards” and not “most unique/historical/artistic pokemon cards”. While these things may matter to many people, desirability is always #1. The people who pay relatively obscene amount for trophy cards are establishing the market for it. An expensive sale is a signal that other people really desire a card and our sheep brain just suddenly wants it too.
It’s so easy to see when you’re looking. There are so many cards that went from 3 figures to 5 figures in a matter of months or a couple years. No rarities, scroll, ring, orb, pearl or whatever, the list goes on. These cards were available for years and no one cared until suddenly one or two sales went higher than expected and now these are holy grails because they have been recognized by a handful of people. The exact trend happened with jungle pikachu/eevee the difference there is that the supply choked out the demand. If that supply wasn’t there those cards would surely be multiple thousands today.
Long story short, nostalgia is just a way to re-expose yourself to this hobby but the main thing that really keeps people collecting is the recognition (via $ value) that these cards are desired by others. Desire breeds desire and it’s hard to reverse that inertia ESPECIALLY for cards with virtually no supply. This is also why people are so emotionally invested in the specifics of prices and that the fear their collection will drop in value is more a fear that people will stop caring about their collection more than it is about a financial loss
I think the original art plays a big role, especially if it was reprinted in English and Japanese. The main victim of this is Kamex Computer Error. If it had never been printed again I think it would be a top tier trophy card, the art is fantastic. If you own a trophy card with original art and let’s say 150 copies, you don’t just have a card only 149 other people can own, you also have the card art.
For the same reason, people tend to prefer Pika Ring over Victory Ring and Mew Orb over Victory Orb regardless of rarity difference. And why the Espeon / Umbreon Prime promos are much less desired than similar rarity cards due to English print.
Rarity is not enough, there is a BGS 10 Scramble Croagunk 1 of 100 on Yahoo but I don’t see people lining up to bid and rarely do with these cards (though maybe they will have their moment in the sun).
Maybe I am too obsessive but I have always thought the best goal of collecting a single Pokémon species is to get every unique artwork appearance (gotta catch em all). If my favorite Pokemon was Exxegutor I would be in love with the TMB cards.
But This is almost my exact point. Most people do not know that trophy cards even exist and You cannot desire something If you do not know it exists.
Charizard is synonymous with Pokémon. I would even say that non Pokémon fans have heard of Charizard. Charizard has surpassed the hobby the same way that Michael Jordan surpassed basketball. The same cannot be said of trophy cards.
I am not saying it is wrong to like trophy cards just that there is no inherent desire. The desire has to be learned.
I wouldn’t say that. The pinnacle of “YOUR” collection is whatever “YOU” want it to be. If someone really enjoys base set and it is their favorite, then so be it. Just because something isn’t the rarest, most valuable, best artwork in the hobby doesn’t mean that people collecting that are doing so with ‘blinders’. At the end of the day, everyone is doing this for their own purpose. Whether that purpose be nostalgia, collecting artwork, collecting rarity, monetary gain, whatever it is.
If you want to talk pinnacle of the hobby, then there’s merit to that claim. But saying someone who views their base set collection as their pinnacle is collecting with blinders, that’s not fair to say. Granted, I could be parsing your words too harshly or maybe your meaning was unclear in the writing, in which case this is all worthless.
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