That first sentence actually leads me to my first point (and also encompasses the entire paragraph: Cars are cleaned and restored to flip a profit, does that mean its corrupt to restore cars to flip a profit by not mentioning it?
So we can do the exact same thing with the exact same purposes for cars, pianos, art, and everything else, but we can’t do the same for cards? No offense, I’m calling bullshit here. Idgaf if the entire community here is against it but I’m using common sense here. And yes if I needed to, I would buy a Kurt’s card care Rayquaza.
Yes… of course. What kind of question is that? Of course it is corrupt to lie by omission about what you’re selling.
I’m involved in vintage watches (another item where restoration is common) and you sure as hell disclose if a watch has been polished, non-original dial or handset, movement change etc.
I don’t know about cars but Chatgpt seems to be pretty unanimous about that too -
A word of advice: unlike social media platforms like X/Twitter or IG, being the contrarian here does not get you more points or a larger following. People will just stop listening to what you have to say. It’s not that dissenting opinions are frowned upon here, it’s facetious arguments and an unreasonable demeanor that causes others to dog-pile against you.
You are intentionally ignoring the points being made here time and time again. You are comparing apples to oranges and trying to drive the square peg into the round hole in order to defeat some imaginary strawman with a big “e4 vintage boomers” taped to its face.
Ever since you got triggered by tidaldreams or niko, you’ve been here trying to prove that you are right about something at all costs. You are not listening to what people have to say and being argumentative for the sake of being so. You would even go so far as to buy an altered card just to prove that you were somehow in the right. That is how a child throwing a temper tantrum would act - not a young man who people here have come to respect and enjoy being around.
Let’s use a phone for an example. Let’s say I buy a brand new iPhone 17 and use it for 3 months. During those months I cracked the screen and somehow ruined the battery to the point where it dies within hours of being fully charged. Now, let’s say I want to sell that phone and get a new one. I replace the screen and battery, clean it up to the point where it looks brand new and then list it on eBay.
Do you think that phone should sell at the same price as a brand new iPhone 17? Wouldn’t it be unethical of me to list an expensive device as brand new when I know for a fact that it isn’t? Personally, as a buyer, I would rather own a device that I know is truly in the condition that matches the price.
The difference with a card is that I have no way of verifying the cards past. If I’m buying a new cert PSA 10 Rayquaza Gold Star, I would have the worry that I am not actually getting what I’m paying for.
prolly coz one of those are hand painted artwork that took like hundreds of hours and the other is mass printed cardboard where 99% of the value depends on if it gets a psa 10 or not
I’m not gonna hold you have you had anything useful to say besides “modern bad vintage good?”. At least Niko may troll but he knows what he’s saying. You however, just shit on modern and say some things that don’t make sense. I’m sorry, but I’m gonna put you on muted for now.
Since this thread has gone by the wayside, time to get back on track.
Using TCGPlayer market price is only useful when things are really stable. Booms and crashes render it useless. For example, this card is crashing hard. And several listings are way below market price. An owner asking 75% of market, which is $16.66, is useless because there are 6 listings under that right now.
If card restoration is done on your own cards and you sell them with full transparency—openly stating that the card was cleaned—there’s no issue. You’re free to do whatever you want with your own property.
The problem arises when restoration isn’t disclosed. A pack-fresh card should not be valued the same as a card that has been restored. It’s similar to selling a house that previously had major structural problems: even if you’ve repaired the issues yourself, you still owe the buyer clear disclosure about the property’s history.
In an ideal world, PSA would identify these restorations and either reject the card or grade it as “Restored,” but at the moment, they don’t.
I’d say refurbishment is more accurate than restoration. I’d much rather buy a new phone that has not been used over a secondhand phone that was refurbished. I’d be equally frustrated if someone sold me a refurbished phone as new (pack fresh). I don’t think you would find a single person that would argue that a refurbished product is better than a new one. Restoration on the other hand is an art in itself and not a quick repair.
Another attempt at course-correction for this thread:
English 151 SIR’s and IR’s have seen a really solid dip since mid-October, with the fall off accelerating since the beginning of November.
As an example, a PSA 10 Charizard ex is down from a high around $1500 to $950-$1000. Before they spiked in October, the PSA 10 was about $700-800, so unless it continues to dip below that value, it appears that 151 is going through a fairly reasonable price correction. I’ve noticed the same thing happened with other 2023 and 2024 SV sets, but most cards from late 2024 - 2025 seem to be holding strong.
remember who we are dealing with
