Indeed, which is why I believe this point in addition to others you made (listed below) suggest that the card could be authenticated. In fact, if it’s literally the most prolific card in the hobby, it’s arguably probable that PSA will examine whether to authenticate it at some point.
Factors that can support possible future PSA authentication:
• credible WoTC employee statements (perhaps even actual testimony, as in an affidavit)
• stamp pressure testing and comparison (which could could also involve WoTC or an employee)
• edge wear, holo patttern, and other card features
Even if the card or cards are legit it would just be an error/misprint card and not an official release. The only value it might retain is because of rarity, but in reality, it’s just a damaged Raichu…
I’m not sure why it not having official release is a problem.
Jamboree doesn’t have an official release. What if some booster boxes showed up magically? Would people authenticate them? Would their lack of release make them any less collectable?
The information recycled from Rusty’s video contradicts what I was told by higher ups at WOTC/Nintendo.
No ex WOTC employee is going to talk to PSA about a card that was never officially released. It doesn’t help when a staff member tells you, “I know the guy who puts stamps on cards and thought about making a prerelease raichu for kicks”. If this actually happened, then the hypothetical stamp pressure authentication process is meaningless.
If people take the production managers story seriously, they admit to “throwing away” or destroying the cards = not meant for release. Yet she apparently has 5? There are numerous contradictions between the staff stories. Therefore treating an ex staff members statement as gold is at minimum inconsistent.
The more we discover as collectors and discuss with staff, the more obscure and convoluted the card becomes. At this point there is nothing legitimate PSA can verify outside of a collectors desire for a story to be true. Legitimacy has to be legitimate, not emotional.
You’re talking about two very very different situations.
Jamboree is a confirmed set that was in the making, but was then cancelled. No leaked images of cards, sets or anything were given to the public. There is ZERO WAY of authenticating anything like that.
PreRaichu is a legit card, with little to no info on it, that no one can get a solid story or image of, that is technically an error.
Released or not released, any 3rd party authentication needs hard facts. Either way, both of those have no legit info to back up an authentication.
If a “legitimate” batch of Jamboree cards was found, they definitely wouldn’t be able to be authenticated? Even if WotC employees could vouch for them and they were the source of cards?
The points I made are only useful in the context I presented them. You’re taking them out of context, the pressure is to answer the question presented, if what @smpratte said is true it’s irrelevant. Not to mention not many people are going to know how to do it to verify if the stamp is aftermarket or not.
PSA won’t authenticate it, Gary said he would get them to if a real one came through, but otherwise there’s nothing that’s going to get PSA to recognize it. So it doesn’t matter what Ex-Wizards employee statement come through.
As far as the edgeware/hoilfoil/centering aspect goes that’s for one PR Raichu and one only. There’s literally zero other options. You might as well call the PR Raichu a one of one card, and it’s not leaving its owners hands.
When someone says that a card can’t be authenticated. Do they only mean that the current lot of companies will not authenticate it?
A singular card could still be considered technically authentic even if it can’t be graded, correct? Or are we giving all that power to grading companies?
With high end collectables, I’d be more trusting of a PSA copy than that of a raw copy, especially a card of this magnitude and scarcity. Like, if I was to ever buy a legit Illustrator, tbh I’d only get a graded one given the amount of fakes out there, and I don’t even collect PSA cards.
The problem with word of mouth is that social media allows for anyone to open their mouth. This recent thread on a fake snap pikachu card is a great real life example. Luckily this site is full of seasoned collectors. That same card was posted on a social media platform, and majority of the individuals thought it was real or were naive.
Any item of significant value needs to be psa graded. This is the standard for all auction houses, and necessary for today’s market.
I think it’s just that there’s no way to verify the origin other than stories involving WOTC employees.
So if someone brings a PRR to PSA, they don’t really have an official reference point to confidentially say it’s real enough to put their reputation on the line.
That’s how I’m interpreting all of this, but perhaps I’m not understanding fully, it’s a little confusing.
There’s no official release. There is no way to 100% verify any given copy. The card does not exist in any way that was officially sold, documented, distributed, or whatever.
For the thread at large, this is sad but true. I remember having wide eyes when I read about this thing for the first time some years ago when I was in late elementary/middle school. Of course I had no concept of the magnitude of nearly $10,000, but that was a lot of zeroes, especially when the fabled 1st Edition Charizard was easily attainable for a few hundred mint. I just couldn’t fathom a Pokémon card being worth that much… sure I knew about my dad’s baseball cards and I knew about cards like Wagner, but… I had Pokémon. It was a very outlandish and spectacular thing seeing this hushed stuff about the Prerelease Raichu. Alas, that hype has died down noticeably. Seeing the prices of the omega-scarce cards go ballistic these past couple of years, I always thought about Raichu and how it just isn’t keeping up in popularity. The problem with PSA really is its grave in my opinion, which is bigger than just PSA. It’s not a verifiable item. I do still believe it can be a legitimate collectible, my previous example a few months ago talking about the Gretzky Wagner card. It has been confirmed (depending who you believe) that the card was trimmed, but that doesn’t stop people from dropping millions on it. If a real Prerelease Raichu, for example the one that’s real (Persins, right?), went up for sale it could easily fetch a shitton of money because there are people who value it I think. It’s really incredibly gimped though, so it’s unlikely.
I can’t help but see the no official release thing as largely irrelevant, although I can see why PSA would think it a problem, as they have reputations to keep and money not to throw in a dumpster fire.
I think of it in the same category as prototype Mac computers, prototype car models, and other unreleased consumer goods, all of which could reasonably be found to be authentic, but it doesn’t have the luxury of being difficult to replicate or fake like those things just mentioned. Bit of a sticky situation.
I spoke to someone with a chemistry degree and background in printing. He said it may be possible to compare the green foil used on an authenticate Prerelease Clefable and compare it to a claimed authentic by studying their isotopes. He said it would require pretty sophisticated equipment, however.
I’m regurgitating what he told me. I don’t know much about chemistry.
I thought about this before. There is people that could compare the stamps with forensic and chemical ways to determine if the stamps are the same ink and done by the same machine. But anyways, it‘s still an unreleased card.
For me the PR Raichu is not dead because it has never been alive : D